Creators on the Couch – Grandma Chainsaw 2
Anthony: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to Capes on the Couch, where comics get Counseling. I’m Anthony Sytko.
Doc Issues: And I’m Dr Issues.
Anthony: We are back with another creators on the couch, or in this case create who Singular on the couch as we are joined by half of.
Fantastic team behind Hocus, Hocus and Grandma Chainsaw, the effervescent, and always entertaining Allen Dunford. Allen, once again, welcome back buddy.
Allen Dunford: Hey, I’m so happy to be back for my 50 11th episode. So thank you guys for, for having me. Like always.
Anthony: Yep, yep. Just Allen tonight no will, unfortunately. Where is Will
Allen Dunford: will is working.
Anthony: Yes, working.
Doc Issues: I was gonna say, that’s a thing. Yeah.
Allen Dunford: Sadly. Yeah. So I, I don’t know if we talked about Will works in the art gallery here in town, and he has a set schedule, but then he doesn’t, so it’s one of those things where if they have a show coming up and he has to hang stuff, then he’s, he’s there making sure all the pieces [00:01:00] are labeled and all that
So not quite making enough bank from the Kickstarter to, to quit the gig just yet.
Allen Dunford: Soon, hopefully. Soon, soon. Working on that, working on that.
Anthony: Understood, understood. Well this is your sixth appearance on the show
Allen Dunford: Oh my God. It doesn’t feel like it, honestly.
Anthony: Yeah, you, you’re gonna get your own category of episodes on our website, like cuz they’re categorized and then there’s like, we’re gonna have creators on the couch.
Below that, we’re just gonna have Allen and Will episode puts, it’s like you just wanna listen to all the Allen and Will stuff back to back. Yeah. Here it is.
Yeah, we’re season one.
Here you go. Here you go. Here’s, here’s the whole from start to finish. So for those listeners who have not. Been privy to one of the five prior appearances on the show.
Allen, why don’t you just give us a little bit of rundown on who you are and what, why you’re. I
Allen Dunford: don’t know why I’m here. I haven’t [00:02:00] discovered that purpose of myself yet, but I am. That makes two of us. Yeah. Right. So my name’s Allen Dunford. I am the co-writer and creator of Pocus Hocus and Grandma Chainsaw.
We, we’ve done a couple other comics and, and short stories and stuff like that, but those are the, the two I guess well lacks a better term, the the two big ones that we’ve done. But yeah, so we, we like to try to keep it into the fun, weird and unexpected genre and always sprinkle in our own little brand of, of dark humor and, and horror in
And if you haven’t already, definitely go back and listen to those first. Episodes because they are some of the funniest and also most off the rails creator interviews that we’ve ever had because especially as we get more and more accustomed, I think the first one we stayed pretty on the rails because we didn’t really know you guys yet.
Allen Dunford: Yeah, I didn’t Then I get that we were playing it safe. Yeah, I
Anthony: get that. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. [00:03:00] Now at this point, it’s like, oh, all right, Allen and Will are on. We’ll, we’ll spend, you know, 15% of the time talking about the, the Kickstarter and, and the comic. And then the rest of the time is whatever else pops into our noggins.
Doc Issues: That goes before recording. That goes after recordings. Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Allen Dunford: We, we’ll be here till probably midnight.
Anthony: I hope not cause my ass gotta go to bed at some point. I’m, I’m very plenty
Doc Issues: tired. I, I got plenty of work to do otherwise, cause paperwork is just sucks when it comes to my job and I’m bad at it.
Allen Dunford: So, you know what, say in the workforce paperwork makes the dream work. Right. Is that how it goes?
Doc Issues: Yeah, it does. If you, if you light it on fire Yeah. It, it, you know.
Anthony: Wonderful. Okay. No, that’s, that’s, the paperwork makes the firework. Oh,
Allen Dunford: okay. I’m so sorry. I get my, my phrasing mixed up. I’m so sorry.
Anthony: Gotta get those, those TP one reports stay. T p s reports, they, they have a, they give off a special glow. [00:04:00] Yeah. And I don’t go, and
Doc Issues: I know we’re way off, but I’ll just do it anyway. So I don’t know if you guys have seen the whole effort, like guy just throwing papers into the air saying, you know, enough of this, the, the main problem is with my job.
It’s like, you, like we all do that. And then right afterwards it’s. Us on the floor picking ’em up. Saying, just kidding. I need these. Yeah, just
Allen Dunford: kidding. I need these and this job.
Anthony: Yeah. So if you could go ahead and pick up those reports. Yeah, that’d be great.
I was told I could listen to music at reasonable volume. I, I, I used to have a red stapler on the desk with a red swing line stapler, forget desk. I, I used to have an office by the window and, and I could look outside and I would see the squirrels, and I would pretend that the s were.
I’m going set this building on fire specifically. I specifically as, as for mar for Margarita with no salt, and they, and they put salt in my margarita. I I could write a [00:05:00] letter to your board of tourism. I, I could have this place condemned. The, the fact that guacamole, the fact
Doc Issues: that you are, are doing the entire thing, I.
I, I am going to tie this back. So the fact that my judge is responsible for writing something like that is also responsible for Beavis and Butthead is also responsible for King of the Hill. You wanna talk a wide range of ability. Idiocracy, yeah. Yes. Crazy. You’re right, you’re right. Just the reason I say that is, It’s amazing what your brain can do when you just let it go wherever it needs to with an idea.
And I think there is a grain of truth of that with Allen and Will. So,
Allen Dunford: oh, good way to tie it back, doc. Right?
Doc Issues: Oh, I knew what I was
Anthony: doing. Don’t worry. Dang, man. You, you, bang, you came in with down to, to, to the metaphor man. You started going over the rail. Deer, man, you know, kind winning them, you know, crazy with crazy train there, man, you know, and then of a sudden come on back and then circle around and dang man, it just make one little big old circle.
Beautiful thought man.
Allen Dunford: I think we broken [00:06:00] Anthony.
Anthony: Oh no, I was broken long, long before this recording started. Alright so we are here for Grandma Chainsaw two. Mm-hmm. The first issue, which we loved kinda. In a very different place than where anybody started coming. And, and again, we spoke about that.
Yeah. When, when we recorded the first episode, now we’re here and Doc and I have had an opportunity to see at least the first handful of pages from the, from the sequel or issue two, and it picks right up where issue one leaves off and it is just, Bonkers as one would expect.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. We, we hoped that we, we blended it well, right, because after, I think we, we have the first six [00:07:00] pages that you guys have read.
There’s two we were talking about this a little bit backstage, but there’s two more pages of, okay, we’re developing, this is what’s about to happen, and then that page, they finally go into the house, and then from that point on until issue four, it is just, Off the rails. Like we, we don’t have to really do any more character development from that respect.
Of course there are gonna be situations that arise that are gonna challenge some of the characters emotionally. But we, we get to just cut loose and no pun intended, right? And, and we get to just, just go absolutely crazy. And how issue two ends is probably more wild than issue one. And I just can’t wait for you guys to see it.
Doc Issues: That is a high bar to set.
Anthony: Yeah. I’m, I’m scared and excited. Uhhuh, now a little aroused. [00:08:00] Yeah,
Allen Dunford: I get it. Right.
Doc Issues: So I. I’m going to say this because I know Anthony has this idea, and I know I’ve thought the same thing, but Anthony says it much better than I do. We have both had this thought, you know how movies always have certain flows where there are action scenes and there are mm-hmm.
You know, quieter scenes where you have to set the pace and the tone and you know, you can’t just keep firing over and over again on the same high notes and all that. Well, what if you just did away with that? What if you just did high note after high note after high note action que like just. Stop and just kept going with it.
Yeah. So when you say things like that, I start thinking to myself like, you, you already had some interesting things happen. You’ve already introduced what clearly are some let’s just say neuro divergent and unique people that are trying to handle this situation. That
Allen Dunford: was the best way to word those people.
Doc Issues: I. I am definitely intrigued as to how how anyone actually gets anything done with this. But I obviously, I’ll, I’ll leave that up to you, but if there are any hints at that, if you could, if you could like, just, just kind of give us a. Give us a little hint maybe, right?
Anthony: So just, just, just need a little hint, just a little, just a little bump to keep me going.
Allen Dunford: Okay. Yeah. I’ll give you, I’ll give you a, you know, first one’s always free, right? So what we did with the series, and this was something that we, we had to set down and, and really think about, because again, you can have too much of a good thing, and if you do, Too much of a lot. Then it’s weird at how much it equates and turns into your brain as it’s only just a little if, if that makes sense.
Right? Yes. Because you, you’re used to having that high and then it’s just pulled right out from underneath your feet, and then it’s like, oh, well, where do we go from here? I don’t really care anymore. Right. So [00:10:00] what we really tried to do with this, Was really, really set it up and just have fun and just, just be absolutely crazy.
But also have those lulls like you said, doc. So you know, at the beginning of issue three, we have a lull because of, of how issue two ends. We have our lull and then we, we set up the pace then going forward. I think it’s a good way to do it, and I think as a creator, we, we’ve kinda learned that and, and found our pacing especially with pocus and I’m sure we’ll get into how POCUS has kind of changed as the series has progressed.
We like using the opening pages. To set the pace. Like even though grandma Chainsaw two, those are the opening pages, they’re still really fast paced and still crazy, but we still got the point across for this is what we have to do and these are our characters. So now once they actually make it into the house, it’s just, it’s game on.
Like we get to have fun. With this series, it’s so hard [00:11:00] to talk about and so hard to tease because I feel like if we give anything away, it’s gonna give away the ending because the endings, it’s, it’s weird because it’s not what you expect, but then when it happens, you’re gonna be like, oh, duh. Right?
And it, of course, it was something, this just kooky,
Anthony: right? Yeah. There’s, there’s a shot of grandma Chainsaw very early on in this, these pages and. She’s engaging in some knitting.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. Yeah. It’s, it’s knitting.
Doc Issues: That’s what we’re calling it. Yeah.
Anthony: Yeah, yeah. We’ll, we’ll call it knitting, cross stitching, perhaps.
Doc Issues: definitely. Yes. See, that’s the thing. It’s definitely stitching.
Allen Dunford: Yes.
Doc Issues: involved stitches,
Anthony: absolutely. Yeah.
Allen Dunford: After we did the first the first issue, right? We we didn’t plan for it this way, but it is just kind of like how it happened. So we, we did the first issue and we have the blood splatter that says Grandma Chainsaw chapter [00:12:00] one.
Then we were like, we’re part one. And then we’re like, man, let’s just see what we could do for part two. We did the knitting of the skin, and then in part three we were like, okay, well we have to step it up. And the title page for that one’s gonna be it’s. Yeah,
Doc Issues: it’s cool. Nice,
Anthony: nice. You, you stepped it up from, from that?
Mm-hmm. Oh, okay. Okay.
Allen Dunford: Yeah, I, it’s, and this isn’t like me trying to be that guy, but I, I don’t know what we’re gonna do after that for issue four yet. All right. Because, because issue three is so metal, what we
Anthony: do. Wonderful. All right. Wonder Boss. All right. I see. You know, it’s like I call and I raise. Yes.
Allen Dunford: But yeah, so with, with where the series is going so far and the feedback that we have received from Grandma Chainsaw it was better than what we expected, honestly, because we felt like it was so high concept. But it just seems like people are just gravitating toward it and having. And it’s kind of cool whenever we [00:13:00] launch it and then we’re getting messages from people being like, finally I’m so excited.
Right. I, I think that’s when, as a writer and as a creator, that’s when even if you have one person just message you and say, thank you for making a second issue that’s when you’re just like, okay, I’m, I’m doing something right.
Anthony: Yep. Yeah. It, it is definitely a high concept. To be sure, especially with the, the twists that you take it at the end of the first issue.
And so I’m very much looking forward to seeing where the rest of this goes now that we’ve kind of established at least these rules. Mm-hmm. So the, the set of Otaku. Shall we say to put it tactfully that you’ve assembled? For, for this crew, how, how real are they to you? Because I definitely knew.
Some of these guys in college there was Wayne and Jeff. They [00:14:00] would’ve absolutely fit right in with the dead squad. With the dead squad, without question.
Allen Dunford: I think we talked about it last time. But the, the Dead Squad is something that we, we were trying to figure out, oh God, this is gonna sound like I’m sadistic, but I’m talking That’s chain, that’s a good thing.
So when we were writing this thing, you know, we were like, okay, so we have our four characters, then what, this is a splasher, how do we make it a slasher? What constitutes a. Right. How do we keep people engaged over a four issue span for a story like this? And we’re like, okay, well obviously we have to introduce new characters.
Who are these characters gonna be and how can we make ’em fun and, and still somehow fit into this world? Will’s idea. Was originally, he’s like, well, let’s just have like demonn hunters and like, maybe they’re like good old boys. And they, they drove in on their pickup truck and they have like shotguns in the back of their truck.
And I’m just like, yeah, that’s a [00:15:00] really good idea. And we were, we were developing it and then we got to the point where we’re like, this is, it’s not, Too boring, but it’s not where we feel like it could be. And then I was like, why don’t we make them like AV club rejects pipe deal, right? And then that’s where the debt squad came about.
And we’re like, okay. And then the ideas started flowing right? Let, let’s make them only use their gamer tags. Let’s, let’s take that couple that everyone hated to be around and put them in there because they’re just so disgustingly obsessed with each other. Let’s put the one guy in there that thinks he’s God’s gift to everything.
Right. And we just, yeah, and we just had fun and then we made two ton, and we love two so much. It’s,
Anthony: it’s a very, very interesting cadre of, of characters that you’ve assembled and I look forward to them meeting Hazel. And then they’re [00:16:00] inevitable demise shortly thereafter. Because
Allen Dunford: Yeah, because that, so that’s the thing, right?
It’s no secret on what’s gonna happen to these guys. Yeah. That’s something that we have not strayed or, or tried to shy away from since the, the beginning of all of this. Because the, it’s funny, right? Because the dead squad is ultimately there to ramp up our body count. And we’re okay with that?
Doc Issues: Yeah.
Anthony: I mean, it fits the genre, it’s the trope you need. You can’t have a slasher type story with like two deaths. It doesn’t Right. Really work. Mm-hmm.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. And, and that was something again, like, that’s what we talked about. So with these guys, you know, I, I grew up how I spent my weekends I spent ’em playing Friday Night Magic, and I, I spent them playing d and d with my friends, right.
And we would play at our local game store and, and. It’s, it’s funny the stuff that like, I’m in that culture, you know, I love this stuff. Like, I read manga, I, I [00:17:00] do all this stuff and it’s just funny to even just kinda use it to make fun of yourself too with some of the stuff and, and how, you know, And even just play on how people perceive that culture too, right?
Because we were thrown in crap that we thought maybe we’d have to do like an explanation for, but it seems like it’s been pretty universally grasped on what it’s,
Doc Issues: if you know, you know. Yep.
Anthony: Yeah. It’s it’s very much. No longer the, the people who are mm-hmm. Shunned, as you say, like, yeah. A lot of the cool kids play d and d now. Mm-hmm. There’s still a little bit of a stigma, but it’s nowhere near from when, say you and I were, you know, of, of people of our cohort, our age cohort were, were doing this stuff back in high school and college.
Right. And even. Was even worse before that. You know, you go back to something like [00:18:00] the eighties you see in Stranger Things. It’s like, we have to play, you know, in somebody’s basement, right?
Allen Dunford: Yeah, exactly. And, and that was the thing too, like also with that, it wasn’t so much from like a a subculture standpoint, right?
We also wanted to make these characters just so gross that you can’t wait to see them die. So that, I think that’s like. That’s a good check mark of a slasher to have when there are some characters that you are emotionally attached to. Because, you know, I think you, you also need, you need that balance, right?
But then there’s the ones that you’re like, oh, thank God I can’t wait. You’re chomping at the bit for the next issue because you’re hoping that this one guy makes it or this one doesn’t.
Doc Issues: Yep. Yep. That’s it. I, I just like to call them the, you know, the, the pillar tournament.
You know, just at, at some point you’re gonna have that one shining moment of gore.
Allen Dunford: Oh yeah, dude, it’s, [00:19:00] and that’s the thing too, like there’s, There’s a scene in, in the second one, and I can’t wait to talk about it with you guys after you read it because I pulled a lot from my childhood and, and threw it in there.
So I, I’m very excited to talk to you guys about that one.
Anthony: Okay. So we’ll get you on the, on the couch. And the
Doc Issues: hot seat. Yes. Okay. There you go. Yeah.
Allen Dunford: And the, it’s the, this scene, I think you guys will know what I’m talking about, especially being raised by my grandmother. Mm-hmm. So it’s gonna be, it’s gonna be a lot of fun to, to talk about this and, and how we can pull from our influences and our surroundings and stuff.
Anthony: So the Kickstarter is live mm-hmm. As of the other day, or at least when we’re recording this Yeah.
Allen Dunford: As of, yeah. We, we launched it yeah, about four days ago. We funded within about 24 hours, so, yay. But we still we got promises to keep a miles to go before we sleep. So we, we have 20 odd days right now.
And then we’re obviously starting to push for the stretch goal portion of the, [00:20:00] of this whole.
Anthony: So I see that there are some, some stretch goals. So at 4,500 there’s gonna be a sticker. Yes. At 6,000 there’s going to be a print, and at 7,500 there’s going to be another print. Yeah.
Allen Dunford: By the series artist Brian Londo, who is just exceptional.
Anthony: is, that is definitely a word. There are many, many colorful, positive words you could use to describe Brian’s art. Let’s talk about some of these covers because I’m looking at them and just. Doc, which one’s
Allen Dunford: your favorite?
Anthony: Okay, so it’s, it’s, it’s it’s still the sajad. Yeah, it has to,
Allen Dunford: oh yeah, man, Sajad did crazy.
I love Kit’s manga cover too. So
Anthony: I was just about to say that that one is also solid because first off, I mean, it’s, it’s kit. He’s got such a distinctive style. It, it just jumps out at you right away. I’m assuming that is, Accurately translated Japanese [00:21:00] for Grandma Chainsaw.
Allen Dunford: I, I put up Hit thinks he got the Kaji right on it.
And then I, I did the tried and true take Google Translate on your phone and hold it up to it. Right. And it translated to Chainsaw Grandma, which I, I think is probably a good translation, right? Yeah,
Anthony: that’s, yeah. Not as good as you’re gonna get it. Yep.
Allen Dunford: And then of course, Brian’s main. Yeah, he, he understood the assignment and it’s just, he always does.
Yeah. It’s just crazy. And then Ruben Mocho I, you know, whenever I talked to him about it, I just wanted a good iconic action, like just cover and he. Man, just the, the way that he positioned the blood splatter and everything, and the look on her face mm-hmm. And how narrow he made everything. It’s just mm-hmm.
He, he did such a good job. He really
Anthony: did. It’s, it’s very narrow is is a good word for it, because it’s very angular, it’s very [00:22:00] sharp. Right. That’s not a reference to any cutlery or anything like that, but the, the angles of the face and the angles of the artwork is, it is, Sharp mm-hmm. And, and singular focused.
So I do thoroughly enjoy that. And then we’ve got
Allen Dunford: it’s sajad, what did we say about Sajad’s cover?
It’s just clean. It’s just a good clean cover.
Anthony: Well, it’s, it’s, it’s not clean there, but blood there quite, quite a bit of blood on there, so I don’t clean. I get what you’re saying. It kinda gave me a little bit of
Doc Issues: like a joker feel to it.
Allen Dunford: Yeah, definitely. Yeah. I just love, and I,
Doc Issues: I would say more, I’ll be honest, as soon as he mentioned it, I’m just literally like, just flipping back and forth with the covers.
I really enjoy these types of things is going back and forth. So the
Anthony: eyes, that’s another thing that I love about, about the Saja cover is the eyes. Yeah. Mm-hmm. There’s no pupils, [00:23:00] right?
Allen Dunford: Yeah. It’s, it’s all white. God, it’s just horrific. And like, like you were saying, doc too, like so on, on this thing.
What we wanted to do, especially, you know, going forward and stuff, we want each cover to feel like it, it’s its own beast, right? We want all the variant artists to have their own personality because that’s the purpose of a variant cover, right? it’s a variety to showcase the artwork of the artists and how versatile and different they can be from the story.
And I, I just think that these guys, it’s just, it, it’s something for everyone and it’s kinda like what we did with POCUS five. Like I love s John’s cover for that too, because it looks drastically different from this one. And he did again. He did such a good job. And then of course we have our exclusive, the Hollow Foil Metal cover by Juan Angel.
We actually found Juan when we were looking for just another cover artist. We saw his work and Juan does mainly these Eldridge horror portraits. So we’re like, oh, let’s see what he does with the grandma on a chainsaw. And then we got that and we’re like, this is [00:24:00] horrific. Yep.
Anthony: Yeah, it’s.
Beautifully creepy. And I’m, I’m just, I’m here for it. Although I’m sure
Doc Issues: this wasn’t the intention because at least with the, you know, with the first first edition I loved a lot of those covers and my daughter saw one of them and said, oh, I have to read this.
Allen Dunford: How old was
Doc Issues: your daughter? She’s 11.
So I basically said, I’m like, okay, hold on. Yeah. And mind you, because I would be a hypocrite because I got exposed to those things around that age, you know,
Allen Dunford: decades ago. So my first movie was Terminator two. Gotcha.
Doc Issues: So, yeah, so it’s not that I didn’t say she can’t read it. It was more like just do it during the day when. Awake because I didn’t want her to freak out at night or something. And I don’t know why I was worried because honestly she’s doing some shopping for new clothes for the summer and stuff, and [00:25:00] the first thing she does is drag my. Wife to hot topic and get some of these like death metal style t-shirts. So I’m just like, awesome. Oh, okay. Nevermind. We’re good. Alright, so
Allen Dunford: we’ll send her her own copy for the, for the next one. Got it. Yeah. She is
Anthony: very much her father when it comes to that kind of, that kind of thing. So we’ve got all the varying covers. Love the.
Allen Dunford: Oh yeah, the Dead Squad t I don’t know who wants to be an honorary member for the Dead Squad, but we thought it was just hilarious just to throw that t-shirt in there.
It’s just, it’s a cool logo.
Anthony: Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know the, the interlocking D N s I just, I really, I, I dig it. It’s simple, but straight. Plus it’s black and red. Literally my two favorite colors. So, you got me. I’m, yeah. Made it just
Allen Dunford: for you, Anthony. It’s all for you Anthony. It’s all for
Anthony: you. That’s what I love to hear.
Just, just [00:26:00] love it, love it, love it. And then of course you’ve got the different tiers and the add-ons where you can catch up on. Not just the first issue, but also pocus hocus. Right. Now I see that among the, the tier and the add-ons and such is the horus in hell number one Ashcan.
Yes. Now we have seen. More of horus in hell
Allen Dunford: you have. And it’s kind of a an exciting thing because that’s gonna be our next campaign is gonna be the fully fleshed out horus in hell issue one. So, so
Anthony: that is, that is the next campaign before we get back to pocus.
Allen Dunford: Yes. Yeah, so the, the sixth installment of Pocus Hocus, we’re working on that right now as well.
And we’re kind of gauging it to see. So we’re kind of in a weird spot right now because we’re about to hit the direct market with POCUS one. Right. So the sooner we can finish grandma chains, [00:27:00] The sooner we get in the direct market, but we also wanna keep putting out pocus because we love that story so much and we already know where we’re going up until like issue 12.
So it’s just one of those things where we’re trying to find the time and the, the gas power, I guess that to do everything. So it’s just, it’s a, it’s a fun balancing act for all this, especially when we have these projects that everyone on the team is just so passionate about and having such a blast with.
Anthony: It’s a wealth of riches at this point. You’re like, oh, which of these well received and acclaimed projects should we work on next? Yeah. Oh, I’ve only only had enough time to work on all of these passion projects that everyone seems to enjoy and people want more of. We, oh, woe is me. Oh, whoa. Oh, well
Allen Dunford: we are.
I do wanna talk to you guys about this here in a second. But we’re, we’re anxious to see how horus in hell is. Because it’s, it’s our first time producing a full book with Kit Wallace because his artwork is so [00:28:00] different from Brian’s, you know what I mean? But you know, Brian is doing a variant cover for horus in hell so we’re obviously keeping that spirit there too.
And Brian might be working on something else for, for Horus in Hell but I’ll reveal that later because we obviously wanna. All the team together for, for all this stuff, because we’re all just having a blast, man. But yeah, we’re excited to release that and you guys got a chance to see three new pages and the cover that we haven’t revealed yet.
And I will say this, I, I love everything that Kit does, but the new cover for horus in Hell might be one of my favorite things that he’s ever done. Okay.
Anthony: Yeah. You had sent it to me over text and I looked at it and I was like, oh, oh, this is, yeah. I was like, holy smoke.
This is incredible.
Allen Dunford: Yep. This is this. That’s the spirit of the book. So that’s where we’re going with it and it’s just, it’s just wild.
Anthony: Let’s talk about another project. This one is a little more, shall we [00:29:00] say, personal to doc and I Let’s talk about the Skinner. Oh, okay. Wonderful.
Allen Dunford: It’s a, it’s a heartwarming tale.
Anthony: is. It
Doc Issues: lots of, yes, lots of warming and
Anthony: yes, it puts a smile on my
Allen Dunford: face. Yeah, so I think we talked about it before. Yeah. The, the folks at bedbug asked us to do another short story. For their rose blood manor who anthology. The first one we did was the Wondering Man, which was about a art connoisseur who gets more than one he ever bargained for with a masterpiece painting.
Right? And then now this one rose blood manor takes place in an asylum. This, in this issue, and. I read through the frame narrative that they have and then I was like, I think I have a good idea for a story. We’re gonna do one about a serial killer that happens to be also living in the asylum and then out of my brain poured the Skinner and I think I need help.
Doc, you got time after this?
Doc Issues: Based on what happens in the story? Probably not.[00:30:00]
Anthony: Yeah, it’s it’s. It’s a lot to take in. Mm-hmm. So,
Allen Dunford: okay, so the Skinner, it kind of does what it says on the label. It’s like our grandma chainsaw, right? Oh yeah. So it’s about a it’s about a serial killer who skins people because he is trying to make the sinner thinner because a voice in his head is telling him to do these things and he finds out his ultimate purposes, he actually needs to be the victim.
Yeah. Which we thought that was kind of a fun twist, right.
Doc Issues: Yeah, absolutely. And it’s fascinating because on a daily basis I have to ask that type of question. Like, is there anything that’s telling you, things that maybe we don’t hear or, or, or we don’t understand or, is there anything specific if you, if you are able to hear things that other people don’t?
And in this case, I’m, I’m used to people sometimes saying like maybe a little but. Anything specific I can make out or, yeah, it tells me bad things, but I try to ignore it and all this. In this case, it’s more like, yep, it’s there. Let’s go, let’s do this
Allen Dunford: thing. Yeah. We’re best friends. [00:31:00] So I, the, the artwork on this thing obviously like everything we do, we, we tell Brian, just go crazy, have fun, and I, I really thank Brian was in his.
And he made something so dark and gritty and it just felt, sounds weird. It felt right to the story and everything completely blown away by the Polaroid pages that he made for pages four and five for the spread of it. Mm-hmm. And then the reveal of the angel and the knife. You know, I thought that he did just a, a cool job on, on all of it.
And yeah, you guys, if. You happen to, to read it for the anthology or anything like that Anthony and Doc’s name may or may not show up in there as one of the Skinner’s victims in the Polaroid page. So yeah, that
Doc Issues: looks nothing, by the way. That looks nothing like us. But then again, I guess that’s the point.
Allen Dunford: point, right?
Anthony: Yeah. I look a little different with the top layer of my epidermis removed. [00:32:00] So I’d imagine. The features are gonna be a little off.
Allen Dunford: Yeah, just a little bit. But yeah. I hope you guys liked it. Thank you guys for letting us throw your names in there.
Anthony: And yeah, you texted me and you were like, oh, you know, we did this thing, we threw your names in there.
Let me know if it’s not okay and we can edit it out. I’m like, in what universe would we say don’t?
Allen Dunford: Yeah. Some people are, some people are weird about it and I always wanna make sure, you know, we’re paying respect for, for people’s wishes and, and stuff like that. So I, I get it,
Anthony: I saw it and then I, I showed my wife and I was like, we are.
This comic now, like we are named
Allen Dunford: Yeah. In it again. Amazing. Yeah, I, I’m really, I’m really happy with how the Skinner came out. Writing short stories is, is hard. A lot harder than, than what I would think because we’re, we’re trying to get across you know, this what I felt like was a relatively complex story in eight pages.
And, I hope that we, we did that at.
Anthony: Oh, [00:33:00] y you did. So now where, where can folks get this anthology?
Allen Dunford: So it was on the Rose blood manor Kickstarter. They’re about to launch Rose blood Manor three, and you can get back issues. We are not gonna be on rose blood man, three but we’re on issues one and two.
So if you do back rose blood man three, you can always get the previous issues as well.
Anthony: Okay? Yep. All right. I will scroll through that. Checked at the Kickstarter. So you know, after I get done backing grandma chainsaw, grandma chainsaw number
Allen Dunford: two
Anthony: yeah, as, as always at this point now it’s like, okay, you know, let me get lemme get some, you know, a variant cover.
Obviously I don’t need. All of the, yeah. I don’t need to catch up on the entire library. Right?
Allen Dunford: The survivor’s pack. Yeah.
Anthony: Yeah, not, not necessary at this point.
Allen Dunford: And I, this is what I was wanting to talk about with you guys I feel like we’re, we’re really all getting in our stride over at the, the Top Hat camp.
We were very. With how POCUS five turned out and it, it really did just give us that much more drive for, for POCUS Hocus [00:34:00] six because. We felt like we’ve really set the world up with how dark it is, but still tried to keep the humor going and this one was a little bit more challenging because things are getting really serious now for, for the group.
Right. And I don’t know if you guys remember what chapter six is called, but it’s, it’s chapter six, the Death of Hocus Hocus. So we, we thought that that was kinda a, a cool teaser for what’s coming next. Sure.
Anthony: Alright. I’m, I’m hungry. I’m here for it now. Yep. I’m gonna be, you know, we’ll, Be very excited for the horus in hell hell.
Mm-hmm. Kickstarter, but all the time I’m going to be going, when are we gonna see focus and Emily and, and everybody else.
Allen Dunford: Focus and Emily. Yeah. And the family. And so yeah, we’re, we’re excited to, because in the next issue, we, we finally get to dive in the Lilly a little bit because issue five is, is really our setup.
Right. We had to, we had a bunch of characters. We had to go [00:35:00] and get in. This is all, it’s, you know, we had to aladdin that shit. This was a whole new world. So we, we really had to like, make sure we, we gave these characters just enough screen time to where, oh, I wanna know more about this person.
They seem kind of interesting, right? So, so now we get to really go in and, and show Lily as, as a three dimensional character in the next one and her interaction with her assistant. And we just get to. A, a good character development scenario while still maintaining the pace and, and the severity of everything.
Anthony: All right. So, you know, we’ve, we’ve talked about Grandma Chansa, we talked about Pocus and horus in Hell. Mm-hmm. We talked about the Skinner. Is there anything, in any new universes that you and will either individually or collect? Are working on that is, yeah, we uh, very different from these other stories. We have
Allen Dunford: two other series that we’re currently developing.[00:36:00]
So, because Grandma Chainsaw is gonna end at issue four, and, and I like using this example, we don’t want a Jason goes to Manhattan situation, huh? On our hands where we don’t know what we’re doing with it, and we’re just, Hazel goes to the big city, stuff like that. Like w with something like this.
And Doc, we were talking about this, like where you can have too many highs, right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then that’s when you, you bought ’em out. It’s weird how it happens. Like you’re, the euphoria spikes and then it just crashes and burns. Yep. So we, we don’t want Hazel to overstay her welcome. And we think with how it ends, it’s gonna be very satisfying for people while still also leaving them wanting more.
And if we ever decide that we wanna branch off from Grandma Chainsaw after that, hey, great. And if. We we’re happy with saying this is it. This is a our four issue mini for, for our slasher horror series. So we were thinking, of course in that vein, what can we do next? Right? So we’re working on a detective story called One Sunday Afternoon, and it is a, it’s about a.[00:37:00]
Detective who is given a case on a Sunday where he keeps finding the bodies of children and we call our killer in at the Sabbath killer because he only kills on a Sunday. So we’re really playing into that and just having a lot of fun. Getting that going. And this one’s looking like it’s gonna be a graphic novel just because of how the story’s laid out.
We think that it’ll be better told in one setting. So we’re, we’re doing it that way. And then the other one that we’re cracking up over it’s in the same vein as Grandma Chainsaw, but it is called Deacon Dan’s famous Chili. Oh my God. And it’s about a church dea. Who has a very secret recipe to his chili.
Yeah. And people can’t stop eating it.
Doc Issues: Uhhuh. Oh boy. Okay.
Anthony: Oh, alright. So let, let me get this
Doc Issues: straight. You have
Anthony: does, does Coldplay show up at any point? Coldplay?
Allen Dunford: Oh no, they, they should. It was, yes. Scott. Scott. [00:38:00] No, it was, was it radio?
Anthony: I showed up. Oh, it was Radiohead. It was definitely Radiohead’s. It was play was Radiohead.
Allen Dunford: So we we have this very cancer in his ass. Yes. We, we have
Doc Issues: a, there’s also a Tales from the Crit episode. It wasn’t chilly, but
Allen Dunford: yeah. So, and it had did it have, didn’t it have like Dean Cain in that episode or
Doc Issues: something? No. Well, you’re right. It was a Superman. It was not Dean Cain. Oh. It was Chris, Christopher Reeve
Allen Dunford: Thank you.
Because yeah, whenever we were talking about it with Brian we’re like, so this is what we’re going for. We’re, we’re doing a a Sweeney Todd meets Dexter type deal. Yay. And thrown in with a little bit more like, why am I rooting for this guy? He’s terrible. But of course it’s gonna be very dark comedy, very brutal, very graphic.
He can dance. Famous chili. All right,
Doc Issues: so you’re, you’re hitting, more of the horror notes. You have a mystery graphic novel coming up. So what you’re basically telling me [00:39:00] is you. Everything that you guys produced to take up all of my free time. That’s what I’m hearing.
Yeah. That’s, that’s the ultimate plan. That
Allen Dunford: that was the, whenever we have our round table discussions at Top Hat for you know, like our 2023 calendar, 2024, this is kinda what we’re looking at. The number one part of the agenda is how can we take up most of doc’s time, you know, but, but.
Doc Issues: In, in all seriousness though, but in terms of demographic, like you’re hitting the types of notes where you pull people in and that’s, that’s an impressive thing to do and making sure that it stays varied enough and, and I definitely appreciate you pointing out that you don’t want any one character or series to, to wear itself out.
Mm-hmm. So I, I really do appreciate that. That way I don’t have to groan when I hear about three more Star Wars movies, but That’s right. A little off, a little off topic, and I don’t know how Anthony feels about that, but whatever.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. So, and that’s, and that’s what’s weird, right? Because with POCUS Hocus, that story [00:40:00] lends itself well to be an ongoing series because of, of how fantastical the world is.
And honestly, with pocus, the sky’s the limit because there, there’s so many supernatural forces that we can pull from and, and just, just crazy worlds that we can visit. And there’s so many different scenarios from where you sell your soul that POCUS finds himself in. And even if it plays out one way, we can still take it a whole nother direction and it would still work.
But Grandma Chainsaw only works well in a vacuum. What One Sunday afternoon only works well within that singular story. Deacon Dan. As crazy as it’s gonna be, it’s only gonna work well in like three to four issues, right? So that’s why we’re trying to keep it varied.
Still also have a good enough selection of titles that really we try to find something for, for everyone if they’re looking for something darker, right? And something that’s just fun. Ultimately at the end of the day, as long as you’re having. We’re, we’re doing our job. So yeah. And I hope these things [00:41:00] deliver.
But yeah, it’s just been it’s been a blast so far doing all of this, and I appreciate you guys especially just kind of being here for the ride since the beginning and, and seeing all this crazy crap that we’ve
Anthony: come up with.
You keep writing really entertaining crap, and we will keep bringing you back. I mean, that’s, that’s why you’re here six times. Yeah. Like I said, you’re, you’re gonna get a category on the website just for, you and, and will, yeah. Just show it
Doc Issues: up.
Anthony: So we’re we’re gonna start wrapping this up. Allen, we’ll have links to the Kickstarter and everything else in the show notes.
So people can click on it and hopeful. Continue to, to back this fantastic content. Where can they find you on the internet?
Allen Dunford: Yeah, so you guys can find me on Twitter at chapsoffury and you know, honestly following us on Kickstarter and our subs is the top hat [00:42:00] studios.sub.com that our newsletter is, is obviously easiest because we won’t blow up your inbox if we have something going on or just some artwork we wanna show off.
We’ll send it over to you and you can check it out and have fun.
Anthony: Awesome. Awesome. And hopefully when we get you back next time on the show, hopefully will conjoin us. Yes. That he will not be working. The sound of that. Come on man. It’s Saturday night. Yeah. The hell you doing working?
You guys are
Doc Issues: lucky. I wasn’t called in to work for
Allen Dunford: this, so, Hey. Yeah. It’s like, yeah. Poor doc just always has that phone.
Anthony: Fair enough. Fair enough. So, that’s gonna do it here. As always, you can find all of our episodes on our website, capesonthecouch.com. We are on Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, and Facebook at Capes on the couch.
This episode is gonna be released while the Kickstarter is still live. So you’ll have plenty of time to go ahead and back [00:43:00] this fantastic book. This episode comes out. You will also have time to get your tickets for PuchiCon, which is,
Allen Dunford: what’d you call me?
Anthony: We’ll be making our first panel appearance at PuchiCon in Atlantic City on May 14th, so May 13th and 14th. You can go to PuchiCon. Again, we’ll have links to that in the show notes as well, and get your tickets there if you are in the New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware area, and can travel. Atlantic City and see Doc and I give a live panel presentation for the first time ever.
We’ll be talking Vash the stampede from the Trigon series. So can’t wait to bring that to everybody’s ears. And if you are likely not going to be able to make it to the convention, don’t worry. We will be recording it and releasing it as an episode at a later time. But very much looking forward to getting.
Manga [00:44:00] for the first time ever as a show doc has been kind of poking and prodding here and there like a velociraptor, testing the weak spots in the fence to see where he can break through. And with this convention panel appearance, I finally turned to him and I said, all right, that’s a’s a very anime manga, heavy con.
Let’s do this. Let’s go, let’s do this. Who should we? Who should we do? And he was like, You know, my body
Doc Issues: is ready. Wait, let’s, yeah, let’s make this clear. The reason I ended up going with someone from Tri Gun is because it was at the request of my daughter, cuz I introduced her to it. So
Allen Dunford: I was gonna say, VASH is overrated.
You guys should have just done guts from berserk, but whatever
Doc Issues: I would, if I actually took the time to you. Really thought that berserk mattered. Shots fired.
Allen Dunford: Oh.
Anthony: Oh. Don’t say that cuz Ariel will drop the Patreon membership over that he. She was devastated when the creator [00:45:00] died. She
Doc Issues: too. No serious. No, seriously.
No. Seriously, it it. No. It’s amazing. I’m That was clearly,
Allen Dunford: yeah. I like too, the problem with TRI
Anthony: was like about to like, These sons of bitches.
Doc Issues: Dude, I’m not, no, I’m, I’m not that ridiculous. Don’t worry. I still have my senses.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. Try gun’s. Awesome. But the manga for try gun does not make any sense. Right.
That’s, it’s, it’s wild how much sense it doesn’t
Doc Issues: make. Yes. I’m, I’m aware and I was explaining the differences to, to my daughter and Yeah, the anime’s awesome. That’s what I’m saying. I’m like, she, she watched the anime and I said, You know, and as I’m going through, I’m like, you have no idea how much
simpler this is. Yeah, because I did it backwards. I got introduced to the manga first, and I didn’t like it.
Allen Dunford: Well, I, I did it that way though. I watched the anime and I was like, this is awesome. I can’t wait to read the manga. And I saw, I picked up manga. I was like, what the hell is happening? Like, this doesn’t make any sense
Doc Issues: because, because it, [00:46:00] it’s filler, you know?
But anyway, and I’ll, I’ll leave it.
Allen Dunford: Yeah. This is a whole nother episode.
Anthony: Yeah. Now I’m like, oh, I wanted to read the manga because I was like going to the source material and now you’re, you’re leaving a very bad taste in don’t. This
Allen Dunford: is one of those rare moments. You guys have heard it here. Capes on the couch.
Don’t read the book.
Doc Issues: Watch. I still, well with Anthony cuz he asked me, oh, well what can I have it? I’m like, I still have it somewhere. I can’t find it. I can’t find it. But I do have the anime if you, if you want it.
Anthony: So I’ll get there. We’ve got a month, so we’ll figure it out. But this could go on for forever.
But in any case Allen, thank you. as always give our best to Will and hopefully he didn’t drop any paintings in the gallery tonight. And oh yeah, tell him, you know, he was missed and, and we’ll catch him next time. Will do. Doc, thank you guys again. As, as always, daca. Anything else you. Toss in.
Doc Issues: Not really.
When you consider, we’ve been [00:47:00] talking about murderous grandmas, a lot of supernatural stuff, serial killers, detective mysteries and all of that. I’m just gonna have a great night’s sleep because you know I could, I could die happy right now.
Anthony: I bet you could. And it would probably be at the hands of someone who wants to see you do harm.
For Doc Issues and Allen Dunford, I’m Anthony Sytko. Thanks for listening, and we will see you soon.