Capes on the Couch Transcripts Creators on the Couch – Phillip Kennedy Johnson 3 Transcript

Creators on the Couch – Phillip Kennedy Johnson 3 Transcript


Anthony: Hello and welcome to Capes on the Couch, where comics get counseling. I’m Anthony Sytko.

Doc Issues: And I’m Dr. Issues.

Anthony: We are back with part two, although this is technically the third official time that we have had Philip Kennedy Johnson on the show. So Philip, thank you once again for taking the time to speak with us. Of course, I appreciate it.

PKJ: Always a privilege.

Anthony: Yeah. Yeah. It’s good to have you back. So if you haven’t already had an opportunity, go ahead and listen to the, I guess, the last part, which is part one of the second appearance, and this is part two, or the third appearance, whatever the number is, it’s the last episode, the last episode, season two, part two. There you go.

There you go. There you go. So go, go back and listen to that where we talk Superman and Alien. And so we’re going to be talking some other stuff, but real fast before we, we get into the rest of your, your recent work, there was one question. I did have because we spent most of the time last time talking superman and we were discussing Mongul and war world and the the fantastic saga but you also had a really cool story i really appreciated the metallo arc that followed war world saga and so my question is metallo really kind of seems to i don’t want to say fully redeem himself but there’s definitely a softer edge given to the character with the introduction of his sister tracy and I, I think it just kind of gives a new color to Metallo and John Corbin as a person, as a character.

Where did that idea come from to give Metallo the sister that was kind of the driving force behind a lot of the stuff?

PKJ: If I want to go way, way back, the inspiration for this story came from a Marvel story, actually. When I was a kid, I, someone asked me about some of the most influential comics. To me as a reader, like things that made me fall in love with the medium or that had a long impact.

And I was gonna recommend, I’ve, I’ve said Superman 400 over and over again in interviews. That’s a, it’s a comic that means a lot to me and everyone knows that. But one that is less well known, I forgot the number, actually. It was a Spider Man and Iron Man team up against Blacklash. And I, I did, I dug it out.

I found it kind of doesn’t hold up really. I remember it being a very impactful issue to me. At the time, the reason was that it was really more about Blacklash than, than either one of the heroes. It was in this random ass town. I think it was in Cleveland or something. It was like a trade show happening.

It was this really weird setup. He was recently out of prison and he was trying to find work in his old hometown and Iron Man was there for whatever reason for the trade show or something. He had some kind of a work thing there and you kind of see some of the people that Blacklash knew back when he was just a guy.

And they remember him. They know him, they know that he’s been to jail and they kind of shit on him. And he goes and sees his parents and that’s a huge disappointment. And he’s kind of pushed around by his old schoolmates and all that. And he’s this guy that you get the impression he’s trying to go straight and the world just kind of won’t let him.

And so in that issue, it’s just a one and done and he goes back to crime, gets his ass kicked by the good guys, goes right back to prison. And even as we kind of close the door on him on this story, he is talking about how he’s going to, borrow a little bit of money from his mom and buy this nice suit and she’s going to be so impressed and, he’s going to, find a good job and everything’s going to be okay.

And he’s like crying as he’s thinking about this. And as a kid, I was just reading, I was used to very different kind of comics and it just left me feeling in a way that I wasn’t used to at the end of a comic book. I was like, huh. Like that, that was kind of the beginning of this crazy turn for me as a reader, where I was like, are there bad guys?

You know what I mean? Yeah. I just thought that was really interesting that they show us this other side. I mean, he’s still a criminal. He hurts people in that issue real bad, you know, and he’s, he’s committed all kinds of crimes and he is kind of a jerk, like when you read his inner monologue, he’s.

He’s talking like a, like a bad guy, but he still wants his mom to be proud of him. And he’s still, he’s making the half ass attempt to, to go straight. And it just gave me much, a much more complicated view of the whole thing. And I wanted that for Metallo. Now, Metallo to me is a very one dimensional villain, the way he’s usually portrayed.

We kind of think of him as this, a visual image. You know, he’s like this really awesome looking Terminator with a kryptonite heart. He’s got such a striking design. That’s really all that most people know about him. His origin has been retold a couple of times. There was a really, really old one where he was like this Clark Kent looking guy.

He looks just like Clark Kent for whatever reason. And you know, there’s one later where he was, he was just in like a car accident and some mad scientist just kind of. Puts them back together again and makes him a supervillain. It’s like not even up to him. He doesn’t have any motivations of his own to be after Superman.

It’s the scientist that’s using him that way. So he’s just, he’s just kind of going along for the ride for no reason that I can discern. And then when, in the New 52, Grant Morrison sort of rewrote him, made him a soldier who had volunteered for this steel soldier program or something, and then it all goes horribly wrong and he kind of makes them into this other thing.

And that was the new 52 is still technically canon now. So that’s the one that I’ve built on, but I wanted to see a guy that has motivations. If I have a pet peeve in comics, it’s the capital V villain that there’s just nothing to him because I mean, that’s not how people are, no one thinks they’re the bad guy.

Even people who clearly are. Yep. You know, everyone thinks they’re the hero of their own story.

Doc Issues: Yep. Because just jumping in only because I don’t think people give that enough credence. I mean, I’m seeing that with people who break touch with reality and, and almost every single one. It’s a guarantee.

I’ll say this right now. We get people that have grandiose ideas. They’re God, they’re Jesus, they’re these famous figures, current celebrities, all this other stuff. The only few times where I’ve had people say they’re the devil, a demon, or they’re being controlled by someone else, they give the agency away and they’re saying it’s torture.

So you can’t have both. You can’t say I’m a good person and I feel good about myself. It just doesn’t work.

PKJ: Yeah, yeah. I, I wanted to see a villain. I mean, the best villains are always the ones who think they’re the hero, you know, in my opinion. So I wanted to see that. Whenever I see a one dimensional villain, I put a little, put a little note in the, in the journal.

Like, I got to come back to this guy because I don’t like this. Mongul was another one of those, you know, where we’ve seen Mongul, just the big multicolor alien bruiser. He just wants to rule the world or destroy everything just for no reason. And that’s just not good enough to me. Metallo was very much that for me.

Scott Snyder said something to me once he, where he thinks that every nemesis of a character should be. Like the, the twisted mirror image of that character in some way, either the diametrically opposed thing or the thing that’s almost exactly that thing, except just like slightly pushed a little tweak and the one bad day cliche, you know?

So. I wanted Metallo to be Clark’s opposite in that we have all the, in a visual sense, because we have all these iconic images of Superman deflecting bullets or reaching out and destroying the gun in his hand or something. It’s like Superman versus gun. We have all those images of you know, the hero being the, this bulletproof man.

And that’s, that was kind of my way into Matalo. Like I just thought about him as, as this, this kid who, you know, should have been okay, he was this guy that grew up. He was like a, you know, pretty decent student, liked to draw, kind of look after his little sister a little bit. He was just unremarkable, but a good hearted kid.

And then he gets exposed to this gun and it’s like his alcoholism, or he just, he just fascinated with it and he can’t stop thinking about it and his whole life becomes. This obsession with that gun. He’s like literally trying to become that gun his whole life until he finally does. You know, so it’s, he’s a guy who’s sick, you know, but he still has this sister that he cares about.

The love that kind of sent him down this road in the first place, like that actually inspired him to use the thing. Kill his dad to protect his sister. He’s actually, I didn’t want Metallo to be softer edged or like considered a good guy. What I wanted is to show him every bit as evil, like every bit the murderer that he is.

But he’s a murderer who has one person that he cares about. He’s a murderer who we understand how they became what they are and, and what happened, you know? So to me that just makes them so much more interesting and I hope that’s I hope that story is one that future writers will draw on for their Metallo characterizations and that he doesn’t just go back to being a, tomato can getting his ass kicked all the time.

I want to see some, some legacy to that character where now he has a sister, now he has hopes and dreams and anger issues, but he’s a killer and he’s a villain, but he’s not One dimensional anymore, I hope.

Anthony: Certainly I love the story and I would love to see, you know, that that impact continue. By the way, while you were talking, I did manage to pull up. It looks like it’s Marvel team up number 145, September 1984. Spider Man and Iron Man with a Black Lash on the cover of Mark Scarlatti. The Black Lash slash

PKJ: Whiplash.

That sounds right. It’s a, is it a talkie cover or he’s like, I mean, I’m something I’m coming to your house or

Anthony: whatever. I mean, I’m crazy and I’m coming to your house.

PKJ: Yeah, there it is. Yeah. Yeah. He’s, he’s got a, if I remember right, he’s got a long flowy purple cape and a tassel come out of it. Oh my, that’s perfect.

And like an electrical whip. Yeah, if I remember right, he was, he had been called something else like whiplash or something before that. And they’d kind of tweaked him. I don’t, I mean, I don’t know the history. Like You know, I’m sure 90 percent of Yeah, that’s

Anthony: yeah, I brought it up on screen. There it is Yeah, that’s the cover dude That’s the cover.

Yeah, I was like, okay, let me look up this blacklash character on wikipedia and lo and behold There it is. So we’ll put a link to that in the show notes.

PKJ: It’s dated now, but The impact it had on me then was, was pretty remarkable. It just gave me a much more complicated view of, compared to other comics I’d read where he’s just fighting straight up monsters or, you know, giant robots or things like that, like, Oh my God, this guy actually wants to be good.

But he’s not, like, I just, I don’t know, it was just a very memorable thing.

Anthony: That’s fantastic, and I certainly appreciate that. That’s not a comic I I think I ever read. I know, obviously, Whiplash is a character, but I’m more of the the Anton Vanko. You know, version.

But but I will I will go back and give that a read. I’ll see if I can find that in Marvel Unlimited.

PKJ: It’s worth a read as a thing that is of its time. And there’s a scene, I remember a scene in which some jerk in the bar like dumps a beer over his head or a water or something and he leaves in shame and when he comes back there in his purple cape and trashes the place and kicks the bad guy’s ass.

You kind of root for him. And again, it was just a, thing I wasn’t used to that I thought was pretty, pretty cool. Yeah.

Anthony: It’s that old thing. Everybody is dealing with a struggle. You know, nothing about kind of deal. So, so shifting gears then James Bond. Yeah. Got to work on that for a bit.

I’m just gonna be upfront. I only read the first half. I, I did not get a chance to read God and Country, so I know that it, it kind of followed that. So my, I apologize, you know, my, no, it’s so good. Kind of my understanding and, and my line of questioning is really only limited to the. I was going to

Doc Issues: say, for me, this is, this is purely, okay, I’m just going to admit I’m very weird because it had to be definitely pointed it out of this questions.

I have read James Bond books. I have not seen many of the movies like this. You know, full movies, like I only know it through the zeitgeist from that way, but I’ve read the novels. So I’m always interested, like this is another new take. So I’m, you know, I’ll let, I’ll let Anthony ask the questions, but that’s, that’s the perspective I’m coming from with this.

PKJ: That’s interesting to hear. I don’t think I’ve ever known anyone that’s like that, that, that like follows the books, but not the movies.

Doc Issues: Yeah. I’m a strange, I’m a strange guy.

Anthony: He’s an odd duck, but you know, that’s, that’s why we’re friends. But so, so my question, the first question then is when you were.

Coming up with, I guess, the version of Bond that you wanted to write, was he based more in the Fleming novels, or were you kind of envisioning the films, and was there a particular Bond actor that you had in mind while writing?

PKJ: Well, that’s the thing. That part is actually not up to me, because the license that Dynamite controls for the James Bond comics it’s a license from the, from the Fleming estate.

So it is, it is of the novel version, not the movie version. So if there are characters in the novels that also appear in the films or that just appear in the novels, you can use any of those, but you can’t use anybody that was introduced in the films alone. And as far as characterizations visually, the movies are just like not a thing.

I mean, as far as the, the movies, the, the Daniel Craig’s are my movies, like, for sure. I mean, there’s a couple of them that aren’t very good, but there’s several that are. And just the depiction of, of Bond as A guy that openly thinks of himself as a blunt instrument and kind of describes himself that way and other people describe him that way kind of has that chip on his shoulder, he’s kind of a little more fighty than some of them that we’ve seen, he’s got this like, I dare you kind of, kind of attitude to him that I really like.

And there are elements, I’d be curious to hear from Doc about this, but I mean, the old novels in particular, but really all of them, because I mean, they’re all kind of period pieces I mean, he’s a sexist, misogynist, homophobe, racist,

Doc Issues: straight down the line, like, that’s all it is. Yeah, that’s the thing. I have no issue with that given the settings that all of those are in.

That’s always been my opinion when it comes to fiction. I’d rather have the world as it is rather than the world that I imagine it to be. If you’re really going to create a character that you’re going to have that’s lasting for multiple stories. So, yeah. Absolutely, all those elements are there.

And I think, at least from what I understood, okay, an example. I saw the full movie of Casino Royale, and that’s where Daniel Craig comes in. And there was a bit of a backlash with that only because of the way it was presented. And I said, to be honest, This is way closer to what I’ve been reading than anything that had come before it. So kudos to them.

PKJ: That movie’s pretty good. I mean, it’s, it’s probably the best one in my opinion. And it actually is. I mean, it, it, of course, it adds elements to the film that make it more visually entertaining than the book would have been. Yeah. But all the, all the essential elements from that From that book or there.

Yeah. And including his depiction, kind of. Yeah. I mean, he is, he is kind of a hothead and kind of, it’s different at the, at the end, he kind of holds, he kind of holds a candle for for Vesper in a way that he doesn’t in the book and the book, he’s like a real asshole at the end, after she admits that she was a double agent, he’s like, he’s got.

Oh, no, that’s it. It’s done. So it does make it more sympathetic in a lot of ways, even that one. And other ones do, you know, much more so. So when I got the gig to do this, they said, so it’s got to be based on the books. And I was like, how’s that going to work though? Because I asked, is it based back then or modern day?

And they said modern day. And then I kind of said, okay, well. He’s kind of a terrible person in just about every way. Like, how are we going to make him the, I mean, you know, whenever a new character walks into the room, he is described by Bond by his perceived ethnicity, you know, like he’s just a, you know, it’s

Doc Issues: true.

It’s true. Think yeah. For people, for people that don’t know, like think Archie Bunker, you know, that’s yeah, that’s

PKJ: yeah. Archie Bunker was cool. Yeah, right. Yeah, it’s pretty rough, so I, so we did have to make some real changes. So, so the, the element that I really wanted to hold on to was the blunt instrument angle.

Like that was, that was kind of my way into the character. He’s a guy that, considers himself somebody who just kind of kills people for a living and he claims not to feel any kind of way about it, you know, he kind of does. He likes nice things, these are elements you can do.

There are ways to make him similarly unpleasant in the way that he was in the old books without playing it up to that degree. But some things you just have to change and not ask questions. I mean, there was there was a line from one of the novels, you might actually know what book this is from, I can’t remember if this is one of the Horowitz ones.

But he says he describes a woman as five years as junior and 10 years to old. I,

Doc Issues: oh, okay. So I remember the line. I don’t remember the book.

PKJ: Yeah. I don’t either. I think it was the, I think it might be the one where it talks about how he got his double O status, maybe that Horowitz wrote. Yeah. But I, it’s a good line, but it’s also not, I mean, this is one element of Bond.

It’s like, well, I kind of made me think about like what we haven’t really seen. I don’t remember seeing a Bond girl. Maybe it’s just my own ignorance, but I can’t remember seeing a Bond girl that is his own age or a little older. Hmm. And I wanted to show a Bond girl that was like a double O established when he showed up and was kind of like a mentor figure, not someone that he was just trying to get into bed, but someone that he actually respected deeply.

I thought that’d be kind of cool to see. So that we’re not pretending that Bond is not who he is and he’s not that way towards other women, but we give him a female character towards whom he does not feel that same way. So that was one way I tried to dodge some of the character discrepancies with the original character.

I just don’t think I acknowledged the racism stuff at all. But yeah, I just kind of, I try to give them a similar voice without, without similar worldviews, if that makes sense. Yeah. Well said. And another thing was that I whenever I do these licensed books, I’m trying to tell a story that deeply matters to me personally.

And just kind of dressing them up and with genre trappings that make it feel. You know, fun and exciting still. So, I mean, the Bond story was one I wanted to tell because I wanted to tell, you know, cause I feel a certain way about. Patriotism these days. And that’s a story that I wanted to get into.

And Bond is a character who is famously kind of nihilistic about that stuff, or he’s for England, but like when the, when the chips are down, he’s for England, but he’s not. The guy that’s flying the flag every moment. He’s he’s kind of cynical, kind of just kind of beat down by the, by his experiences.

You know, he just, he drinks too much cause of the shit he’s done and seen. But this this 00 that we introduced, the Bond girl, 003, Gwendolyn Gann. She was a true believer and someone that, that Bond admired very much for that reason. It was kind of like his, she’s the one who kind of gave him The, you know, the patriotic pride that kind of helped helped him remember why they signed up to do this kind of thing in the first place, because, you know, that was,

Anthony: that was a big thing, you know, that she left in that note, kind of like that triggered that whole thing of, you know, like, remember why it is that you, you did this.


PKJ: yeah, she was kinda like his inspiration. And of course, at the very end of that first arc, that all kind of turns on its head and then we get the second arc. So I do hope you enjoy it, Anthony. I’m,

Anthony: it’s yeah, I do, I do wanna get around to, to God and country because like I said, I definitely enjoyed the first half.

It was just I, I couldn’t couldn’t get it digitally and, and wasn’t able to, to. Snag it in the stores, but

PKJ: it was originally just going to be that one, that one arc. And then at the end they asked me to do another one. I was like, man, I don’t know. I’m, I really don’t have the bandwidth. But I did think of an ending for that first for number six.

I was like, shit, that actually would be pretty cool. So we figured out a way to do another arc and so we ended up doing it.

Anthony: But yeah, and I also just really like that the impact of the whole, oh, We’re kind of setting up the new world order behind the scenes and, you know, it’s all going to be, you know, fine and we’re going to control it and come join us and we’ll be the real world government and solve everything and I think in this day and age, you know, to your earlier discussion about like patriotism and stuff and like what that means and, and how that comes across you know, It really doesn’t seem frankly all that far fetched these days to say so I was reading some of this like It’s just kind of I can’t say that

PKJ: this isn’t happening.

Yeah, it’s about the increasing investment of like corporations and things like defense contractors in warfare and so it kind of sets up this, patriotic idealism versus capitalism, bottom line type thing.

Anthony: Eisenhower’s worst nightmare. Yeah.

PKJ: Yeah. And for good reason, there’s also questions of like, so you sign up when you’re young and shiny and you think your country is the good guys and then your, your life continues and they use you as an asset to do things that are not what you thought and by the end you’re kind of looking at it, kind of looking at your own nation and different through a different lens, like what was, you know, this isn’t what I wanted it to be.

You know, but also like in, in, in real life, when somebody today, 2024 puts American Patriot on their social media, that’s not what that shit means usually. Not like it used to, like use it whenever, whenever I see somebody call themselves a patriot in their handle online, I automatically think the worst.

And I hate that, man. I don’t want to be here. I didn’t want to be a place where, cause I consider myself a patriot. And when I see somebody else call themselves that and it’s some January 6th motherfucker, that’s, that’s not what that word’s supposed to mean. Yup. So

Anthony: I, and as a The love of God and country and all that.

No, no. Yeah. As

PKJ: an active duty service member myself. I have strong feelings about what patriotism should be and can be and shouldn’t and isn’t. You know, so I you know, the bond story was was a chance for me to kind of exercise some of those demons And

Anthony: ironically, you know, and and and i’m sure you’re obviously aware of this those people that would put american patriot in their their social media handles or those people that you know, proudly proclaim themselves a patriot would look at you and All you and and everything that you do not patriotic because you’re not following that myopic viewpoint that they have, they’ve hijacked the term and claimed it for themselves.

And, and, you know, anybody who disagrees with them, it’s, it’s a no true Scotsman situation.

PKJ: Wow. Yeah. Patriotism is not nationalism. And I need us to get back to a place where people understand that. That’s, that’s

Anthony: incredible. Yeah. It’s, it’s not nationalism. It’s not jingoism. Exactly. You know.

Yeah, that’s, that’s a discussion for a whole other for a whole other podcast. Yeah, but maybe,

PKJ: maybe, you know, at a bar with no cameras rolling, there you go.

Anthony: Yeah, but you know, but it’s funny, you know, we’re discussing military and patriotism and stuff like that, because I think this kind of segues perfectly into the next character that I want to discuss, which is John Stewart.

and your work on, on Green Lantern and the aptly title, I suppose, Green Lantern War Journal. So, and the first question I had is, given your military background, did you gravitate towards John versus other Lanterns? Or was this, you know, did they want a John story and you solicited, you know, you offered your pitch or were you like, I want to write John. Here’s my story.

PKJ: They offered me John. I, I think the military thing was probably the reason. But there was somebody else on board to write the Hal book. Hal Jordan is the lantern that I grew up with. I did have some books with John in it, but I always kind of just knew it to be Hal. And John was cool, but I didn’t have a, my love of comics came from kind of a small collection.

Honestly, I didn’t have a ton of books. So I feel like even now, no shit, I feel like I’m kind of playing catch up. I just, I didn’t have that many comics growing up and now there’s no excuse. So I, I do read a lot of older stuff as well as try to keep on top of what’s, what’s new, like just remind myself where the bar is, what the state of the art is right now.

But honestly, whenever I got offered a character, very often I don’t know much about that character and it’s a kind of a chance for me to bone up on that lore, which is great.

Doc Issues: That sounds like this entire podcast.

Anthony: Yeah, I was going to say, that’s literally how I handle things. Oh, I don’t know anything about this person.

Let me go, you know, do a deep dive. Let me look up like key issues. And then, I mean, we did an entire month on just lanterns to the point that I got so steeped in the lore, I went and bought now. I mean, you can’t see it here on the camera, but I have the All three volumes of the Geoff John Omnies, plus the the Tomasi and Gleason Green Lantern Corps are on this album.

And in my email signature for work, I have all will be well because I, I personally just gravitate towards the blue lanterns. I feel like if, if I were, if I were lantern that would be my, my color is, is hope. But you know, but I’m also aware that, that you know, hope is nothing without the will to act.

So I thought that was a nice little thing that, that John’s put in there, but You know, and I, I too, like you you know, kind of think of like Hal as the lantern, but I’m also cognizant that at least for, you know, people of, of like me and Doc’s generation, perhaps a little younger than may have grown up with, you know, the, the DC animated stuff, like they know.

John because he was the lantern in the Justice League and Justice League Unlimited. So John is definitely a, you know, a badass character. He’s always been a lantern that you know, I like, like I said, you know, Hal is, is kind of my number one, but, but I definitely dig John. Now I guess, Doc, I will kind of let you handle this, and I don’t know how much you want to

Doc Issues: Okay, no, it’s okay. Look, look, look, here’s, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll just jump in. So,

Anthony: I texted, I texted Dr. Trigger Warning for some of this stuff, and I’ll let him explain why.

Doc Issues: Well, no, I got my phone right here, so I’ll just even read it out, because I’m one of those people, he knows this about me anyway, he said, don’t know if you read PKJ’s Green Lantern Run yet, but there’s a subplot about his mom having dementia and the impact it has on their relationship, just giving you a heads up.

It’s heavy and emotional for me, I can only imagine it’s going to hit you 10 times harder, so call it Trigger Warning or whatever, I’m letting you know. So the reason why that’s relevant so my mother a couple years ago, exact situation died of dementia. My dad basically spent that part of his life just taking care of her at home. And on one hand, it was an amazing thing to see. On the other hand, we, we definitely supported him. But, wow, was that, challenging. And. It’s interesting the way Anthony said that whenever someone says trigger warning for something, I’m one of those people. I’m like, cool. I’m there. Jump in. Dive in. And I did that with, with this arc.

And I don’t even have a question. I just have a compliment. I’m definitely at peace with how my relationship with my mother went and, and I felt like I grieved multiple times for each step. When I lost her in terms of her ability to communicate on a regular basis, then when she actually died, and then all those things.

And then the diagnosis itself was probably the very first one. But all I’m saying with all that is, I think of all the topics that can run through something like a comic, it was impressive. It was impressive the way that you dealt with that entire relationship. But I mean, obviously, you know, Anything you want to say about that or if you want to speak out with that, I, I definitely am willing to listen.

PKJ: Oh, thanks, man. I’m, I’m glad you’re, I’m glad that the story meant something to you. And I’m, obviously, I’m sorry for your loss. I know that it’s a heartless disease, and I’m sorry you had to deal with that. A lot of us do, right? I mean, I feel like it was something that was very relatable that I wanted to show.

I so I, I was telling Anthony that I grew up with Hal, but I when I saw the depiction of John in, in animated stuff, and then later other places, He was another example of somebody that I thought was being a little, like, sold short a little bit. Cause I mean, I remember him as the architect, you know, not as the ex Marine.

And sometimes when you’ve got a team book or whatever, you, you have to, you have to give, you have to have very short, concise ways to kind of sum everybody up. Like, okay, I got one line of dialogue for this character. You know, what’s it going to be? It’s like, okay, Superman says something hopeful or childlike and Batman says something scowly and Flash says something cool and quippy and really fast.

And, you know, Wonder Woman doesn’t use conjunctions or whatever. So. So whenever they kind of dumb John down to the military jargon, as imagined by civilians, it’s just not enough for me. And I wanted to kind of, I wanted to show every element of John that I could in this book. So, I mean, I want, he’s, so in this book, he is the architect.

He’s the son. We’ve, we’ve gotten very short nods to his mother. The civil rights leader that was a big inspiration to him. She’s mentioned very briefly here and there, but we don’t really see her very much. There’s the, the sister that died. That wasn’t a very powerful story a long time ago.

But we haven’t seen her since really. You know, the ex Marine, yes. The ex Lantern. I wanted to bring the Dark Star stuff into it. I wanted this to be kind of like the consummate John Stewart story that kind of hits on everything that he has. If anything, the statement of this book is, you know, that, that John is all things and that John is, you know, while we’ve seen all these Green Lantern stories in which somebody is the unlikely choice for the ring to choose.

And then they prove themself, John was the obvious choice, always. He’s the builder, he’s a tactician, he’s a devastating warrior. He’s the guy that threw his mask away. You know, like nobody does that shit. Superman has Clark Kent, you know, like for him to say, there’s that, that Neil Adams panel where he’s like, I got nothing to hide.

And he throws his mask down. That to me makes him the consummate superhero. That he, he does the right thing and he shows his face. And I, it’s it made a ton of sense to me that he would have gotten that from his mother, the civil rights leader. It made sense to me that the civil, like somebody who presumably marched with like John Lewis or, you know, Medgar Evers or those people who were like, it made such a big deal.

You know, somebody like that would have this inherent distrust of the masked vigilante. So it makes sense to me that John is the one who took his mask off. And also he’s to me, he is defined by the sense of duty, not to America, not to the Lantern Corps, just like it’s just in him, you know, like his sense of duty.

So when he comes home from this crazy space epic that he’s been in on the Jeff Thorne run, and he comes home and now this, you know, because of the events of the Jeremy Adams run, the the Lantern Corps is under new management. Kind of the UP has kind of usurped the Lantern Corps now that the Guardians are gone.

And John doesn’t really believe it in him, and he doesn’t really believe in the direction right now. So he’s like, it makes sense to me that he would step away. Also, I got that thought from Jeffrey Thorne, too. I really wanted to understand, John, before I took my first step. I am very mindful of the Responsibility that was laid at my feet with this book, like this, there’s a lot of people, the black community, the military community, I mean, Green Lantern fans, but the black community more than anyone needed me to not fuck this up, you know?

So just know that I understand that. And then I, I went into this, you know, saying yes, but understanding what it meant to say yes. So I really wanted to do, do right by, by that whole crew and also people. Also, people who have the, who know about demetia, what it’s like.

Go ahead.

Doc Issues: I, I’m, that was more than I anticipated. I, I am greatly appreciative. I think that’s where I’m gonna leave it. Otherwise, like, I’ll have all of my intense emotions later. Holy cow, that. You brought in some layers that I know for other characters i’ve said on this show And then talked it out with with my family talked it out with anthony and stuff like that but for a writer for a creator to say those things.

That gives me chills. Like, I always worry that I put too much on what I’m reading. I’m like, I bring my own thoughts and opinions into whatever it is. That’s just the type of active reader I am. And I know Anthony’s the same way. So, I always wonder, like, okay, am I even coming close to what this person was, what they wanted, and, and In this case, yeah Dude that’s that’s nice.

That is great,

PKJ: right writing. This book really matters to me for a ton of reasons and But the one about the black community is one that like, yeah, I don’t know maybe more than anything I just knew it just like this book has to be a fucking home run and I need to spend the time that it takes to write two books to get this one, right?

Anthony: Well, it comes across, I’ll tell you that. Well,

PKJ: I’m glad to hear that. Yeah, so I spoke to Jeffrey Thorne and Jeffrey said something really, because I feel like Jeffrey does understand John and, and obviously just really is invested in that character. So Jeffrey told me something really interesting.

He envisions John as like, he’s going to do his time of service and then he’s going to leave and just live his life in other ways later. And. That was so interesting to hear because we, we normally hear, we think about superheroes, it’s like, they’re going to die in the saddle. Like they’re never going to quit.

They’re going to keep doing this. They’re driven to do this thing that they do. And that’s all they’ll ever do again. But he doesn’t view John in that way. He views John as doing, this is his time of service and he’ll have his works of peace later. And I love that idea that I love the idea of him going back to being an architect after all this.

So I wanted to explore that, but I also was just thinking about how important that mother thing is. And I really wanted to see her in his life. So anyway, I am trying to add to the Lantern lore. I, to me, I mean, the Green Lantern core part of the DC universe is like the Wild West, like this, it’s so old and the whole, the whole thing is just, it’s limited only by your own will.

And if you have the will, you can do literally anything. I mean, they’re like the Jedi of the DC universe, but older and cooler and like less fettered. So I wanted to see that. And John is the, is. The perfect lantern. So I’ll, I’ll take that to the back. People are always like, who’s your favorite? I’m like, I don’t want to get into this with you guys, but I’ll say John’s the best, now having done the deep dive to really understand John, John is my favorite, but but he’s also just the one who was just born to do it.

So I’m, I’m going to try to use this, this book as the story that makes that case. But even, but yeah, I do, I, I know you’re not asking these kind of questions, Doc, but I just know that I do have people reading this thing to make sure I don’t fuck something up. Like, I Oh, it shows, it shows.

Doc Issues: You don’t even, you didn’t even have to go there. I mean, that’s, that’s impressive.

PKJ: I, I appreciate it. There was one thing that’s come up a couple of times. It’s just. Just little stuff like just getting the hair right. You know, like there were a couple of panels where it came back weird. And I was like, nope, this is like we can’t like the attention to detail needs to be like Anyway, all i’m saying is I care about john and I know that I know that a lot of people care about him, too.

So the editors and me and the artists and are all just all over it So it’s a huge honor to get to do it. And Yeah, anyway,

Anthony: that’s all that’s that’s fantastic. So I I was gonna say the the the revenant queen first of all, I just i’m digging the speech style and just the the characterization of the queen and everything You know, I guess what was the impetus for this?

Because, and, and, you know, I know it’s an ongoing I’ve read up to, I think five was the last one that came out. So I’m, I’m really, I’m really invested now. And I’m like, why is she going after John so hard? So how far out have you mapped? The storylines for this

PKJ: through issues through issue 12. Yeah, it’s gonna this is not an like a true ongoing if it is it’ll be in somebody else’s hands like they’re kind of moving the pieces around the board as far as he was gonna be doing what books but but I’m doing it through 12 and then there’s going to be another thing right after that that also involves John.

Okay okay so beyond that I’m not I don’t know what the plans are for John going forward but so, yeah, that’s where we’re at. But it was always meant to be like a contained story that has. You know a fixed length and here’s here’s where this particular chapter ends Okay, and I would always be happy to come back to john.

I think john’s dope But but for the story we’re telling right now and the things that it’s feeding into that’s we’re looking at 12

Anthony: Are we gonna see guy show up at any point? I think you know speaking of other lanterns that we like guy is one that Like we did an episode on guy and then it was funny We did an episode on guy and then I went and read the full red lanterns And that I was like, God damn, I love Guy as a character, like more than I did when we did the episode.

And I, I would love to see a Red Lantern Omni because I’ll buy that and put that on my shelf right next to the other ones. So I just, you know, I’m just being selfish. I gotta ask is, is Guy gonna show up here at some point.

PKJ: I talk to you freely on these podcasts sometimes, but I’ll go ahead and tell you. Yeah, Guy’s gonna show up.

Anthony: Okay, I don’t need to know where, I don’t need to know when. Yeah, no details. I don’t need to know any more than that. I appreciate that. We know Guy is gonna show up

at some point.

PKJ: Did you read the backups in the in the Green Lantern book,

Anthony: in the HAL book? Your back, your backups, yes.

PKJ: Okay, yeah, there’s a, there’s like the alternate universe version of Guy, like the Like I thought of him as like Sir Kay of the round table, kind of in that book. He is somebody who knows John really well. But he’s not like Galahad either, you know? Yeah.

Anthony: Yeah, Guy is, Guy is a fun character, and like I said you know, we did the episode on him, and then, and then I read the Red, the Red Lantern’s book, and I was like, okay, he’s, he, he’s, he’s a cool dude.

PKJ: Yeah, he’s cool. I didn’t always appreciate Guy. I, the first time I saw Guy, so again, my even now, I mean, he’s, he is a fun character. I kind of think he’s the worst Lantern.

Doc Issues: Okay, okay, thank you for saying that out loud, because I said that with the original one, not that he was the worst Lantern, just simply I’m

Anthony: like, wow, how did he end up,

Doc Issues: like, it’s, It’s always that question,

PKJ: you know?

The unlikeliest, I should say it like that. If John is the obvious choice Guy is the unlikeliest choice. When I first saw Guy, that was when, I think, I don’t know, I can’t say for sure that it was his first appearance, but when it was Emerald, Dawn, or whatever it was, when the thing where we first, when Hal first meets Sinestro and he’s in prison for being drunk, whatever, and his, his lawyer is Guy Gardner, and he’s all buttoned up, he’s in a suit, and then the next time I see him, he’s got the bowl cut, and he’s like super, super macho, and I’m like, what happened to this guy, again, my, my love of comics came from kind of a, not a whole lot of books, and I just didn’t know, the, the, the contrast was just so crazy.

Anthony: Yeah, they, they chalked it up to head trauma or whatever it was that, that happened the change in the character, But anyway you know, again, lanterns, we could, we could go off on lanterns. But the last character we’re going to talk is another one that is obviously an ongoing and this is the Hulk, you know, another, another green character.

So this story is a lot more monster oriented than you know, some of the, the previous Hulk runs. I admit I didn’t I read a lot of the Ewing stuff. I didn’t really. Read the Cates run, and I know that that kind of got truncated for various reasons. So this one is a lot more like monster oriented.

Was this intended because you wanted to kind of shift away from that internal focus, like the Ewing run?

PKJ: When I, when I got offered that book the hardest part was like, how do I not just do more immortal? Cause it’s awesome. Like, I really loved how it, it tied into the original vision for the character, how it’s all very Frankenstein, Jekyll and Hyde kind of stuff.

He’s like the monster that is sort of the good guy, but he’s also the monster of the movie.

I, so I had to kind of sit with it for a bit. I was like, how am I going to do this? Where I’m not just aping Al and Joe. And they told me that Nick was probably going to be the artist. And so I kind of dove into his work to see what he would really sing with. But when I.

Kind of let myself have some room to think about it. I found myself coming around to Hellboy a lot and how Hellboy is kind of this, he thinks he’s one of us, but he’s really one of them, he kind of just walks the earth and he’s this lightning rod for these crazy stories and characters and monsters from mythology and, you know, cosmic horror and folk horror.

And these things kind of gravitate towards him because he’s part of that world in a way that we’re not. So he sees things that to which the rest of us are blind And that could totally be a hulk story too. I don’t know if it’s because of some of the stories that have been in the comics or because of the tv show, but i’ve I still kind of part of me still envisions bruce banner is like the the guy just like wandering the american roads, you know, because he can’t He can’t have a home because of what, what he is.

So I wanted to see that, but I also wanted to see like the Southern Gothic kind of exploration of creepy American shit. If there’s one story that inspired my Hulk run, it is Hellboy the Crooked Man by Mike Mignola and Richard Corbin. Man, that was so goddamn good. I remember

Doc Issues: Oh, geez. I gotta pick that up because I do remember I’m not even gonna say I read it. Like, flipping through and thinking it it looked cool and I never picked it up, so

PKJ: All right. It’s incredible. It’s just incredible. I mean part of it is that Corbin just makes that stuff look like this

Doc Issues: Yeah, that’s well, that’s that’s what i’m saying. Like just flipping through i’m just like I can see why hell boy is cool

But yeah,

PKJ: it’s so creepy so good and he just again hell boy just kind of wanders into it Nobody questions that he’s a big red monster thing. He just shows up and he’s just he just kind of fits into the story there’s this creepy beautiful witch that rides this crooked horse And this woman’s skin is on the bed and then there’s like a, this creature comes back and crawls into it and it takes her form again.

And it’s just this, this witchcraft, eerie, you know crossroads devil kind of, kind of stuff. It’s just so, so good. And that, I decided that that would be my way into Hulk. Where instead of it being Cronenberg horror, laboratories with the lights swinging and, you know, body horror in a black science kind of way.

I still wanted that body horror stuff, but I wanted it to be more of a folk horror kind of thing, where instead of laboratories, you’re, you’re finding things crawling out of the, the, out of riverbeds and potter’s fields and hangman’s trees and stuff. Okay. So instead, instead of building instead of explaining gamma in like a science y way.

We’re, we’re kind of explaining what Hulk is. Hulk has this new name in the run, what they call him the fractured son. And it ties in with this thing called the mother of horrors. And her daughter was called eldest and there’s this whole mythology that ties into existing Marvel lore, but also adds quite a bit to it.

And that’s, that’s kind of my thing. That’s why I make comics, man. I just love world building and this is a chance to do that. So I’m, I’m using blots.

Anthony: I was literally just about to say. You mean Philip Kennedy Johnson is doing extensive world building and lore creation? Say it ain’t so. Why, this is unheard of.

No, this is what you do, and you do it so goddamn well. And you bring up the body horror. I just, I really appreciated this and, you know, obviously, to some extent, this is your, your writing, but also this is just, you know Wilson and Klein and the artwork is just the focus on the pain and the effects of the transformation on Bruce from, from going from Bruce to the Hulk and vice versa.

I just, I really appreciate the, the ick factor that, that it brings because, we haven’t really seen that like in the MCU. It’s it’s a very smooth and I appreciate it for for that perspective of you know Bruce coming to terms with it and everything that’s my secret cap I’m always angry and he just lawlessly transitions into the hulk and makes the punch and everything and i’m like that’s cool, but I like the in the original, the Norton one, and even, you know, for all of its various flaws, the, the Banner version, I think they, they showed some of that, you know, the, the pain and the, the bones cracking and, and everything.

And I just, I love that part of it. And I’m glad that we get to see that.

Doc Issues: Yeah, I mean, it’s highlighted and I’m just thinking, I’m just thinking in general anything like that. I mean, transformations hurt like, you know, of course you got the physical side and comics. This really where comics usually shine.

And that’s the whole point that anything that is either unwanted or unexpected and is a huge difference from your day to day is going to at times be excruciating. And there’s no way around it. There’s no shortcut to it. I mean, the idea of course, mindset of Hulk versus mindset of Bruce. I mean, it’s, you know, the idea of dissociation, like just all, all manners of coping with.

The inevitable that this does not go well.

Anthony: I want American werewolf in London for the Hulk. Like I want that first, you know, that, that real famous transformation where it’s like drawn out and the bones are lengthening and stuff like that. And he’s like, guttural scream. I want that. I want to, you know, I see that in the comics and, and, and, you know, we’ve definitely gotten that in this run and in others, but like, I would love to see.

Like a, like a drawn out horror version of the Hulk where he is like the thing, you know, that is like there, he’s just kind of, the story isn’t about the Hulk, but he’s this presence, you know, I would, I just, I always appreciate those kinds of stories that focus more on like the The effect that the Hulk has on everyone around him.

PKJ: Right, like, like Jaws or something,

Anthony: right? Exactly, exactly. Jaws is not in the movie all that much. Hannibal Lecter isn’t in the movie all that much, but their presence is, It’s about them. Yeah, it’s felt throughout. Pivoting to the effect that the Hulk has on people. Charlie, I think, is just this fantastic character.

You know, what, what kind of inspired her? Because she definitely feels like, obviously, she plays a bit of a role of, like, audience surrogate and so on, you know, with some of the exposition and stuff. But I feel like there’s, there’s so much more there.

PKJ: Yeah, Charlie, charlie’s important. So the the relationship between Banner and Hulk right now is broken Hulk hates Banner.

So now it kind of gives Hulk a chance to be the legit monster in the movie where it’s, it’s the thing that’s, that’s, you know, stalking you like the, the creature from the ring or it follows or smile. It’s in you and it’s after you and it’s stalking you. And you know, if you’re not careful, it’ll, it’ll take you and become you.

That’s a horrifying thought. I want to see it be more scary. So we’re doing that, but I thought it’d be really cool to have another person in the mix where they have a different relationship with Hulk than they do with Banner and make it like legit three characters. And this kind of, so it gives us kind of this hate triangle where she’s, she really admires Hulk because she’s, so she is somebody that Banner should really be able to relate to.

She has her own issues of, of abuse, like growing up abused herself of wanting to be strong, like being frustrated by her own weakness and wanting to be big and powerful and, and, you know, raging and not have to pay for it. So she grows up actually idolizing Cap. To her, Cap is the super soldier who’s super fast, super strong, always has the answers.

He’s like got all squared away. So to her, Cap is like the man. And she has these fantasies about Cap coming and saving her and getting her out of there, and then they go on adventures together and she’d be like his new Bucky, you know, that’s what she wants. And eventually she does get her way out, but it’s not Caps that comes, it’s Hulk.

And now she’s obsessed with that. She’s like, holy God, this thing is the most powerful thing I’ve ever seen. And she is just, you know, completely just saturated in her thoughts of that. Like what, you know, what would it be like to be so powerful? And so yeah, she thinks Hulk’s amazing. And she also sees Banner.

And she, she looks down on Banner because she sees her own weakness in him, her own fear in him. You know, he’s terrified of Hulk. And he’s a weakling and she looks, she thinks Banner’s super lame. So I don’t know, that just makes a really interesting trio of relationships that I wanted to see. When, plus, I mean, Banner’s trying to help her.

He’s trying to save her all the time. Like, you know, don’t come with me, stay away. It’s not safe, trying to save her. And she’s like, fuck you. I’m not here for you. I’m here for Hulk. And Hulk kind of encourages her. I mean, or at least doesn’t mind.

Anthony: It’s that power fantasy for her of, you know, because of the abuse and everything that, oh, if only I were, had the power of the Hulk and, if only I were strong as the Hulk, like, I could fight back, I could, be the abuser instead of be the abuse, which obviously just continues to perpetuate the cycle and doesn’t actually solve anything.

And Banner, you know, as you said, tries to at least, you know, get her out of that mindset. And some of that is Obviously dealing with the the abuse everything some of that is just the youth and an experience because she’s what? 16

PKJ: she’s I believe she’s 16. Yeah She is she is 16.

Anthony: Yeah, so She’s you know, I hate to put it quite so bluntly, but she’s a kid that doesn’t know shit So, you know, we’re all 16 and thought we knew how the world worked and we ain’t no shit so, you know, it comes from that that hubris.

So that’s why I said I just I I really appreciate how even just these, handful of issues, she’s really become this, completely three dimensional character, very much a part of the story in addition to just, you know, Hulk and, and Bruce.

You know, so I’m, I’m very much looking forward to kind of seeing where this one goes. Now I’ll ask you, you know, the same question, I guess I asked for, for John Stewart, how far out have you mapped for, for the Hulk?

PKJ: Years. Like, it’s, it’s just a question of what, like what kind of stuff they want me to write, but Oh I’m having a great time with Nick.

Now Nick is not a, Nick is not a page a guy kind of artist. He’s putting so much love and time on every page. We have to bring in other artists for other arcs, but we’ve been blessed there too. Danny Earls is about to come on for issue nine, 10 and 11. And Danny’s doing incredible work. And he’s going to be, there’s also some one shots, like standalone stuff that’s, that ties into the tie into other events.

And he’s doing some of that too. That’s all, it’s all been great. But Nick is the standby guy. I’m trying to give him whatever stories he wants to tell. So sometimes I’ll add a thing here or take a thing away to, to accommodate the schedule. But And you know,

Anthony: he’s the, the soccer player, right? He was the soccer player who became Danny Earls?


PKJ: Yeah, he was a footballer that, that he was a professional footballer before, and now he’s doing comics. Yeah, I think,

Anthony: I think Gail Simone had, like, a whole thread that, like, she, she had to counter him, and she was just like, oh my god, you are fantastic, and you need to be getting, like, big two work now.

PKJ: Yeah, and not just, I mean, he is, he’s never been that talented, just his drawing chops are as good as she said, but he’s also Amazing collaborator. He’s just so fucking cool to work with. I love working with Danny. So yeah, look for more stuff from him and me, actually. We’re already kind of talking about doing other stuff.

Okay. Danny’s great. He’s, he just masters, he’s the master of like atmosphere. His, his pages just feel so atmospheric. So whenever I give him another story, it’s going to be all about the setting that we’re in. This, this is where he really shines. And you talk about wanting to see like a long drawn out transformation, like the thing or whatever.

Pick up issue nine.

Anthony: Okay. I mean, it’s on my pull list already. So yeah, so I will be

PKJ: getting it. That’s Danny. That’s, that’s, we took that, we took our time with that one. That’s like half the book.

Anthony: Okay. All right. So very intrigued now,

PKJ: but yeah, I’ve got a, that story, man, I I love my old, I didn’t have a whole lot of consecutively numbered comics when I was a kid, whenever I had two or three in a row, it was like this gift, you know?

So I really like. Short arcs, like one issue, two issues, three issues, maybe. There’s going to be a lot of that in this run. Like I want people to be able to just pick up a book and be good and not have to read everything leading up to that to understand what’s happening. So I’m really trying to like, that’s, that’s one of the guiding lights of the book is making just constant jumping on points.

Lots of first appearances just making it really just fun and exciting and really approachable for new readers to pick it up.

Anthony: Okay. Well, you know, as I said it’s, it’s on my pull list. It’s, it’s in, you know, the books all go in the tab of PKJ comics. So just continue, continue adding to that drawer.

So. You know, you kind of tease it a little bit, but what, what is next? So obviously, you know, you’ve got John and that’s going out to issue 12. You’ve got the Hulk that, that you’re working on. Any other stories or, or things that you can announce?

PKJ: Yeah, I don’t think I can announce it. I can tell you that I’m I’m doing a creator own book right now.

That’s going to be coming out later this year. It’s looking really good. I’m pretty excited about it. And I have a book coming out, another book coming out from Marvel later in the year and another book coming out from DC later in the year. Okay. I can’t tell you what those are going to be. That’s

Anthony: all right.

That’s all right. Who’s who’s publishing the creator own? I

PKJ: probably shouldn’t. I don’t know. Okay. Okay. That’s okay. That’s, that’s

Anthony: fine. All right. That’s fair. Okay. Creator owned. So very much looking forward to that. It’s been, you know, it’s been, it’s been a minute since you, you’ve done one of those books.


PKJ: my, my My balance has been skewed a little too heavily towards license for a while. They kept giving me this stuff that I couldn’t say no to, man. I, So you said

Anthony: last time, like, you know, you were working on A listers. I mean, Superman, Alien, James Bond, John Stewart, Incredible Hulk. Yeah. Where can you say no to any of that?

PKJ: I know, it’s all really Yeah, those are all fun stories. And I’m telling stories in them that I really care about, too. Yeah. James Bond, just like shooting volcanoes at a You know, and if it was just dumb, kitschy stuff, that’s one thing, but we were telling a story that mattered to me on James Bond and the same for John Stewart, big time, same for Hulk, like all these, all these stories really matter to me.

Including the ones I’m, I’m announcing now, the ones that I’m talking about that are coming up later this year, those stories matter to me too, a lot. So I really hope you dig them.

Anthony: Like I said, it comes through on every page you know, that’s why, that’s why first off, obviously, you know, we, we love reading your books and we’re, we’re glad to have you back on, but it just, it comes through when, when we read the characters and that’s why last time we were talking about Superman and everything, it, it is so obvious that you care and, and the work and effort that you’ve put into writing the stories and crafting the, the characters and the world building and the lore and everything.

It just, it, it, yeah. Leads through everything and you can’t help but read it and and get connected and You know, so very much looking forward to it. Obviously, thank you We we would love to have you back. You know, once that creator, own stuff, comes out We’ll we’ll have you back on to to talk about that

PKJ: It’s very much a book that belongs in this show, too.

Anthony: Yes

fantastic fantastic, you know, hey listen if you want, sensitivity readers or, you know, you want some, some professional input, you know, just to reach out to Doc, I’m sure he’ll be, he’ll be happy to help you know, we’re, that’s, that’s kind of why we’re here.

So where can folks find you on, on the internet, social media, et cetera.

PKJ: I’m on Facebook under my full name. I’m on Twitter and all, its all its descendants, let’s see, Twitter, blue Sky and Threads right now at Philip K. Johnson. Two Ls in Philip Instagram I think is also at Philip K. Johnson and i a website, Philip Kennedy where you can find most of my work.

I think it’s pretty up to date. And you can message me on a lot of that stuff too. So feel free

Anthony: We we do appreciate that. You can find all of our episodes on our website capes on the couch. com We are on facebook instagram twitter tiktok and threads at capes on the couch friendly reminder we will be at PuchiCon Teaneck on saturday march 2nd, we will be talking bacchanal the the anime adaptation.

So come check that out. We don’t know exactly what time the panel is going to be yet, but we will be there Saturday afternoon. So you can go to puchicon. com, P U C H I C O N. com to get your tickets. And it’s in Teaneck, New Jersey. So looking forward to that. And as we said upcoming episodes we’ve got Speedball and Deathstroke coming up among others.

So feel free to hit us up on social media and let us know what you think. And maybe make some, some suggestions, you know, our six year anniversary is coming up. So we’ve got some things that, that we’re going to discuss there. Well, thank you again, as always appreciate you taking the time to speak with us and looking forward to bringing you back on later this year to talk about the rest of your stuff.

PKJ: Enjoy it guys. Thanks so much.

Anthony: Thanks for Doc Issues. I’m Anthony Sytko. This has been Capes on the Couch. Thanks for listening. And we’ll see you soon.

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