Capes on the Couch Transcripts Issue 184 – Spike Spiegel (Live at PuchiCon) – Transcript

Issue 184 – Spike Spiegel (Live at PuchiCon) – Transcript

Spike filler cleanup

Anthony: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to PuchiCon Poconos 2023. Thank you all for joining. Okay.

I mean, if we’re doing a panel on Cowboy Bebop, we kind of have to start off with the theme song.

Hello and welcome to Capes on the Couch where comics get counseling. My name is Anthony Sytko.

Doc Issues: And I’m Doctor Issues.

Anthony: This panel is about Spike Spiegel.And as I said, this is just, I would say one of the greatest uh, TV themes ever. And I say that as someone who only just got into the show.

Doc Issues: I agree. I like the ending theme better. Hot take!

Anthony: I don’t know that that’s necessarily a hot take. I wouldn’t say it’s as

common, but it’s not a hot take to say that. I would say, you know, if you’re into something more like, I don’t know S DNA or what’s the The theme from the other scene from the movie, gosh I forget you know, what’s it like, Hey Sweet Cheeks or whatever it is?

Doc Issues: Yeah, yeah, we got it.

Anthony: Yeah, so if you like that a little more, that might be a hotter take, but All right, so good, so good. So it’s a pleasure to be here at PuchiCon Poconos 2023. And tell you a little bit about ourselves. Again, my name is Anthony. It’s, it’s Doc. We co host a podcast called Capes on the Couch. We discuss the mental health issues of comic book characters. For this panel, since it’s more anime focused we chose to do a more anime focused character.

We were at the Atlantic City Convention earlier this year, and we did an episode on Vash the Stampede from Trigun. And Doc is much more into anime than I am. So he’s, he’s kind of the one who takes the lead on these things.

Doc Issues: Yeah I have so many characters I can think of, but Anthony can tell you firsthand, it sounded like we were going to have to debate or research who we were going to do next, and I just immediately said, no, we’re doing Spike.

from Cowboy Bebop, and

Anthony: that’s that. Yeah, you picked Vash for the last one, and that was, I guess maybe like a little bit of thought was put into that, but you said that was more because your daughter, you were just introducing her to Trigun. But then I said, okay, well we need to do another one for this one, and you go, oh let me think, oh it’s, oh we’re doing Spike.

Like, right off the bat, so. And, I, I enjoyed Trigun. I, I did I liked, I did like watching it. I love Cowboy Bebop. I, I never, before having to watch it to kind of prepare for this panel. Yeah, I, I just watched the movie last night and I want to go ahead and buy the series now on Blu ray, especially because it’s no longer on Netflix.

Like I watched it all on Netflix and it was like, Oh, it’s ending October 21st. Well, today’s the 22nd. So I got it in just in time. Plus I watched the movie and now I want to go and find imports. Of, like, the box set from Funimation with the series and the movie and everything. Good for you. Thank you for introducing me to yet something else that I have to spend money on.

Damn you. Interesting way to go about it. Well, there’s worse things I could say, but so for those of you that don’t know or haven’t listened to our show before the way we, we run the show is basically we give a background on the character and then we discuss three issues about the characters.

By the way, I forgot to mention, Doc is a board certified psychiatrist. That’s kind of the, the reason why we, we’ve been doing the show now for five and a half years. Yeah. Is, is Doc is a, a licensed mental health professional. And I have a background in broadcasting and radio. I’m also a big comic book aficionado.

So we kinda, you know, help carry the burden. But we definitely wouldn’t have a show without Doc. But in any case, the point is that we present the background and then we get into three issues that the character has and then we offer some treatment options both in universe, like for the character themselves, and then out of universe, what treatment would look like for a real person going through some of those issues.

That, that they’re dealing with and then the fun part is at the end of every episode we role play a little therapy session of what, what would happen if that character were to be on Doc’s couch. And that gives me the opportunity to have some fun with the voice acting and just, just really play with it quite a bit.

Doc Issues: So, and the spoiler alert, somehow the in universe treatment and the skit itself don’t usually line up. I wonder why. Maybe it’s because life itself doesn’t go that way.

Anthony: And also it’s way more entertaining for the skit to not go the way that we just discussed. Because if you know what’s going to happen, there’s not really fun in that.

So anyway, since we are on a time limit here let’s let’s get underway. So we’re gonna get into the background real fast. Spike Spiegel, created by Shinichiro Watanabe and Toshihiro Kawamoto. In Stray Dog Strut, which is the first episode of Cowboy Bebop, released April in 1998. I apologize, by the way, for butchering the Japanese pronunciation.

Protagonist of the series, Spike he’s a bounty hunter who’s partnered with Jet Black aboard the spaceship Bebop, not to be confused with Cowboy Bebop at his computer. Which I, every, I knew what that was before I watched the series and now I really, really cringe when I see that. So over the course of the series, we learn his backstory.

He’s a former member of the Red Dragon Syndicate. He fell in love with Julia, the girlfriend of his partner, Vicious. When Vicious finds out that they’re in love, he gives Julia the ultimatum to either kill Spike or be killed herself. So she takes a third option and goes into hiding to save herself. And presumably also Spike.

Spike fakes his own death and goes on the run where he teams up with Jet. They are then joined by Faye, who’s a gambler recently woken up from cryogenic sleep. Ein, a Welsh corgi with human intelligence. And Edward, a young Earth girl who’s also a master hacker. So the series is basically just different episodes in their sessions, I should say, I apologize, sessions where they’re out capturing bounties and usually Sometimes they get the bounty, sometimes they don’t, but it’s never really about capturing the bounty.

It’s more about the interactions between the characters and the relationships and the dynamics. But during the series finale, Faye encounters Julia and Julia has Faye send Spike a message that she is in fact alive and she’s ready to meet with him. Which is what she had promised years ago but Vicious ends up having her killed.

Spike goes to the Syndicate’s headquarters and has a final battle with Vicious after fighting his way through, like, two thirds of the Syndicate and killing copious amounts of people. Vicious is killed and Spike is left severely wounded or killed, the ending is kind of left ambiguous. And I know Doc, you and I had that discussion the other day.

Oh yeah, yeah,


Doc Issues: as a matter of fact Maybe, I don’t know if we’re going to do this part of the episode, or just, you know, maybe have a discussion afterwards and leave it for our patrons. But, what people’s thoughts are on that ending? Yeah,

Anthony: yeah, it’s definitely left up to the viewer to decide whether Spike survives or not.

But in any case we’re going to delve into the issues now. So the first one. Vicious, vicious, vicious. Where do we begin with Spike’s issues with his former partner? And the very apt name that Vicious has. So,

Doc Issues: let’s put it this way, and I know I’ve used this term before. You ever heard the term frenemy?


Anthony: Okay, well I’ve had several in my life. Okay, so You’re not one of them, don’t worry. Thank you!

Doc Issues: The main point in bringing that up is, Vicious, I think at his best, in terms of his relationship with Spike, in the long run, could have been a frenemy. Why am I saying that? Because I don’t think those two were ever totally aligned.

And they’re both

Anthony: very good

Doc Issues: at what they do. Not to invoke Wolverine, but still. I think they could have made it work, just not together. And then you invite the idea that there’s a common interest that they’re going to not see eye to eye on. And I’m not trying to objectify women at all. I’m just saying, it could have been any other topic.

They could have gotten into, I don’t know, they could have gotten into sports and gambling and stuff, and Spike owes him a debt. It doesn’t matter. The point is, when superficially you have things in common, and you both excel at something, Yes, you can see positive results, and that will

Anthony: lead to positive

Doc Issues: emotions.

But if, underneath that, there are things that don’t align, You’re going to end up with a lot of resentment. A lot of disdain for what this other person is doing, because It’s either for competition reasons I can do it better, or I simply don’t want to do what you’re doing anymore. And now I have to find a way to tell you that, even though we are in this together.

Imagine a family dynamic like that. You don’t have to imagine, plenty of people live that. Imagine a work environment like that, well they’re living that work environment, I mean it’s a horrible job, I’m not saying that everybody here has anything like that, but I’m saying we all have. Careers where we deal with different people in different circumstances where we know we have to work with this person and I know we’ve done plenty of episodes about that.

But to make it so intimate, the idea that someone you really do want to spend more time with and you both are in a competition, really? That’s not the way we should look at it, but that’s what it is. There is no winner with that. None. None whatsoever. End. On one hand, I’ll get into later why Spike, I think, does what he does.

And you did a great job explaining why Julia would do what she did. Vicious knew what was always his number one priority. He knew that being head of the syndicate was THE thing. And the fact that he had to let that go, he had to let He had to let a tenuous friendship go. He had to let a love life go. All of it.

He did it without hesitation, and he did it. What’s his name? Oh yeah, Vicious. Okay.

Anthony: Yeah, yeah. He is definitely playing the long game there. I mean, and even in the finale, he makes the comment to the elders of the Syndicate that, you know, when the snake bites, the venom takes a while before it takes effect.

And that just because he seemingly failed at that particular moment with that attack, we see later on, spoiler alert for, you know, a 20 year old anime, that the people here, the people who are supposed to execute him, are actually, you know, loyal to Vicious, and they end up executing all the heads of the Syndicate, and he’s like, I’m in charge now.


Doc Issues: and how does this relate to Spike? Cause Spike is the character we’re doing. The point is If you’re dealing with someone like that, then you don’t have a choice. When you say fight, flight, or freeze, the point is you better do something. You can’t freeze. You have to act. You didn’t want him in your life, but when he’s there, that’s it.

Everything else has to be thrown away. And that is how he handles it. All of his emotional responses, any connections with people that are either acquaintances or friends, anything that he wanted in terms of his aspirations for his life, even the love of his life. When Vicious is around, that’s what’s going down.

Anthony: Yeah, absolutely. So, so we’re just gonna segue then into the second issue that he’s dealing with, which is he never got over his abandonment by Julia. And this is something that we see a lot more of. Occasionally, I think like twice throughout the series before the finale either Vicious directly or someone kind of aligned with Vicious, but the name Julia pops up fairly frequently, and it’s always alluded that there’s a lot there, and that Spike, after being abandoned by Julia, just kind of turned off his heart.

And we see the impact that it has on how he treats, Women, we certainly see that in how he treats Faye. I think, I think the creator said at one point that Faye is definitely someone that Spike has feelings for, but he can’t really show it because of everything that happened with Juliet. So he got burned, once bitten twice shot.

Doc Issues: Yeah, that’s trauma. That’s exactly what it is. It’s emotional trauma. So, Spike is anchored. He’s anchored by his own memory of what his ideal love should be. That’s what Julia encompasses. And because of how everything happened, when you have significant events that lead to a lack of resolution, then you can get stuck like that.

In other words, it’s, in theory, a nice thing. Some people may not agree with me on this, okay, but It can be a nice thing when you start to see the annoyances, flaws, idiosyncrasies of the people around you, including the ones you love. Because they can be quirky. They don’t have to be detriments. But if you get that ripped away, all you have is that puppy love moment.

The things that you say attracted you to begin with. And I’m not even saying that it was superficial. Let me make this clear. I’m saying that it was a deep love that he had. I’m going to go with that, basically. But he now can’t have that. So how do you fill that void? Well, Spike’s answer is, in all honesty, you don’t.

You, you either hope that at some point it comes back that way, and he gets teased with that, or you recognize that you’re just gonna shut That entire part of yourself down, and that can lead to significant emotional stunting. It can show in how you interact with other people, because you’re not allowing them the opportunity to get to know you in a way that is going to foster positive relationships.

And it doesn’t just have to be romantic, it can be any type of relationship. And if you’re willing to let negative events cloud how you view your entire spectrum of life, then, yeah, you might end up a lot more alone than you originally

Anthony: intended. Absolutely. Absolutely. Which then, that statement right there about just kind of being lonely and letting things, I guess, impact you more than they should, delves perfectly into the last issue, which is a life of drifting versus a life of intention.

Spike, prior to everything going down with Julia and, and Vicious, certainly had a life of intention, even if it wasn’t the best intentions. Spoiler alert, obviously it wasn’t. But, he was very much going out and doing things. The Spike that we encounter in the series, and that we, we see, is A so laid back as to be almost lethargic and just kind of sleeping through life because I think he, well, I don’t want to speak for you, but I think because of everything that happened, he’s like, well, if I take action, it’s just going to end up turning around and biting me.

So he just chooses to drift through life versus taking action.

Doc Issues: All right. So before I knew that we were going to really do this character. I can say, and I don’t think I’ve ever said this on a podcast before, I really identify with Spike. I mean, really identify with Spike. I am grateful for the life that I have. It is not the one I expected. I don’t know if you remember this, but with AOL, with usernames, things like that, you have to put some details into What you said about yourself.

Do you remember Anthony? What I put for relationships?

Anthony: You don’t have to, I’m just No, I, I I remember the ready to die Was your, your motto throughout high

Doc Issues: school? Yeah. Yeah, but I’m not

Anthony: referencing that, but, but as far as relationships, yeah. I mean, you, you were perfectly content to be the loner. I Oh, okay. I remember that.

I don’t remember the phrase you may have used, but you were perfectly content to be alone, eternal bachelor, and

Doc Issues: keeping it that way. I did not think that long term romantic relationships would be involved in my life. I had no problem with the idea that whether it’s being slapped or simply never even getting into one, I was okay with that.

I figured that my life was going to be a series of well meaning, well intentioned jobs that I would save up enough that I could live almost off the grid, but still have a home base. But be that person that comes in and out. You would be the anchor point. If you ever needed anything in your life, whether with your family, the family you built that I knew you wanted to build, and all that stuff, I would be that person no matter what happened, anytime, anywhere.

Drop everything, be there. Same thing with my biological family, I’d be that person. But don’t you dare ever consider me to be that person that’s there every single day. Doing the mundane. That is not what I intended for myself. If nobody else in the world knew my name, I thought that that would be an amazing thing.

And then she happened. Yep. My wife. We’ve been together 24 years. Since dating. 24 years.

Anthony: Mind you, he only just turned 42, like, a couple weeks ago.

Doc Issues: So I went from a person that thought that his entire adulthood Don’t get me wrong, maybe down the road, different season of life. I maybe have a change of life baby, or I get married late, or something like that.

Okay, I could kind of visualize that. Instead, lockdown from young. And loving it. Total surprise. The difference that I’m saying is I ended up accepting the fact that things didn’t go the way I intentionally sought out and I changed the intention as opposed to being a drifter. I don’t mind people saying that.

And I love the saying, you know, not all who wander are lost. I’m totally fine with that, but I’m also going to add one more thing. And I know you say this all the time, and everybody here has heard this. The road to

Anthony: hell is paved with good intentions. Okay,

Doc Issues: I’m going to change that a bit. Because I feel like it’s way too simple.

By the way, this is a book I think I have in my head where I’ve said, I want to deconstruct every little parable or phrasing or things like that and just grind them up and get every last ounce out of them rather than the one thing that they’re supposed to say. Okay? Anybody understand the concept of a junkyard?

What’s in a

Anthony: junkyard? Garbage and things that people have thrown away.

Doc Issues: Okay, fair enough. So let’s go with, since, you know, they always say the road to them. Okay, let’s go with cars. Okay, a lot of jumped up beaters and, you know, things that are rusted out, the engines gone, all that stuff. How many of them were clunkers?

How many of them were lemons? Were right off the lot they didn’t work? I don’t think that many. I think a lot of them actually put a lot of mileage on them. I think you had a lot of 300 mile, 300, 000 mile cars that simply Went their path, did their thing, and gave up. Appliances. I think there are plenty of those good old fridges that lasted for 20 years before they went bad and now you gotta put the warning in, don’t ever go in one or you’ll suffocate if you try to play hide and seek in there.

Or maybe I’m dating myself. All

Anthony: those things that are important. Or you find something that you put in there and then it turns sentient and tries to kill you and everyone on the ship.

Doc Issues: Wow, wow, wow, yes. I gotta bring it back to the show. I know, I’m glad you put up what I was putting up. Yeah, okay. Perfect.

Perfect. But why am I even bringing that up? Because it’s not the fact that those things ended up in the junkyard. They still did everything that they needed to for the most part. So when we say the road to hell is paved with good intentions, the road to hell is paved with intentions. Intentions that may have been corrupted.

Intentions that may have other circumstances that didn’t adapt. All of those things? Yeah, they paved the road. But that doesn’t mean that the good intention itself is the problem.

Anthony: Okay, I, I have heard that expression thirty eleven times, I’ve said it thirty eleven more, and I never I guess really pondered that possibility until just now. The problem isn’t the intention. Okay. I’m gonna have to chew on that one for a while. Oh yeah,

Doc Issues: that’s, that’s one, like I said, I I don’t feel like

Anthony: there are books that can

Doc Issues: be made with just these little pithy things that we say, that we think we know, but, like I said, you just totally take them apart and find so much more underneath.

It’s a wonderful mental exercise to do. One that probably should be listed as pathological for me because I do it a lot.

Anthony: It’s okay. I mean, I have conversations with people before I have them. Like, so I can map out the It’s like a dialogue tree in an RPG game, but I do it all internally before I have the conversation with the person.

So, yeah, I get it. Yeah, the

Doc Issues: main point with all of that is, take whatever intention you have, and even if it’s not going the way you expect Go ahead and make a new intention that’s going to continue to fulfill you rather than letting the other one wither on the vine. That’s what Spike did. Yep,

Anthony: he sure did.

So now is the part where we get into treatment. And as I said, we always start off with in universe. So what would you say to offer treatment to Spike Spiegel in the universe of Cowboy Bebop? So

Doc Issues: I’m gonna put a little bit of a spin on something that I’ve done with other characters. I’ll be honest, I get a little briny.

So, I would like to consider this ethical because I’m trying to do the right thing. But, that doesn’t mean that I can’t, you know, bend the rules a little bit. They’re bounty hunters, right? So, all I have to do is be a bounty. No, I’m not gonna do anything illegal. I’m just gonna make sure that there’s a bounty on my head and that it sounds like it’s a decent amount of money, enough that it gets their attention.

And, since I’m not a criminal mastermind, and I’m not really trying to avoid the situation, I somehow get caught. The problem is, they can’t seem to track down who or how they’re supposed to You know, get the money from. So that means they have to hold on to me until they figure that part out. I don’t know how long that will be.

But, in typical fashion, as with anyone, even if they’re your hostage, maybe it’s Stockholm Syndrome, maybe it’s just the fact that, and I’ll be honest, this is not an exaggeration, I’ve had random people come up and talk to me that I didn’t even know. So, I know that happens to me, despite the fact that I’m a huge introvert.

So, if that’s the case, what if Spike starts talking? What if I make observations about what they’re doing? Not to get myself in trouble, but just to point out that there may be some emotional baggage there that he’s not willing to address. What if I could show him a different way? That would be my opportunity, all while I’m tied up.

Although, there probably will be times where I get gagged. So, either way, definitely willing to do it.

Anthony: So yeah, well, I, I mean, you’d have to go, you’d have to really set up some, some shell corporation stuff because I feel like if Ed is, is working and, and trying to figure it out, she’s, she’s gonna, you know, just hack her way in.

Oh, please, forget Ed. You really

Doc Issues: want to know about, I’m worried about Ein. I think Ein is gonna, like, just totally knock me out. You remember when Ein had the visor and, and was going to town with that. Woo, boy!

Anthony: Yeah, oh, yeah. Totally forgot about that. Here’s the other thing, though, you have to I mean, if you’re going to do that, if you’re going to put the bounty on yourself, you just have to make sure that the bebop is the one that catches you and not someone else.

Well, I think they’re

Doc Issues: good enough at what they do that even if I do get caught by someone else that they would, you know, somehow find a way, because that’s how these anime things work,

Anthony: right? Yes, I know it’s the anthropic principle. I understand. I’m just, this is who I am. I’m the devil’s advocate guy. Both of us, that’s why

Doc Issues: we end up going so deep into

Anthony: hell.

This is also very true. So out of universe then, like I said, this is the part where we talk about someone A real life person.

Doc Issues: Yeah, okay, so I’m just gonna cut you off and just say, Alright, here’s how I handle this stuff, people. Cause I went really deep into it. So

Anthony: I’m not gonna hide, okay? How would you treat yourself?

Doc Issues: Not even that, let me make this clear. What I’m talking about right now is not traditional mental health treatment, okay? This is not something that you’ll find in a diagnostic manual or anything. But you will find self help guides that do recommend this type of exercise, okay? If you’ve played certain games or RPG games where you get to map out all of your characteristics, okay, in terms of strength, intelligence, emotional Responses, you know, all those other

Anthony: things, etc, etc.

Yeah, the attribute. Right. Like, hexagon, octagon, whatever it is. Exactly, exactly.

Doc Issues: Well, here’s the thing. You can do that for your own life. And, I don’t mean it as a joke. You can do it, let’s say, you know, let’s make it up. Your family life, your finances, your spirituality or religious intent, if that’s something that’s big to you.

Your, you know, your psychological health. The other things, you know, other hobbies. You can make this as detailed or as simple as you want it to be. But the point is, however, once again, how you create the scale. I don’t care if it’s 0 to 5, 1 to 10, whatever. You rank everything out, you put it on this plot.

That’s not the only point. The point is, after you do that, sit with it for five, ten minutes, doesn’t take that long, how does that make you feel? What does it invoke in you? Is it a sense of pride? Satisfaction? Is it anxiety? Is it anger? Whatever it is, that’s your key. That’s where you know you need to take action.

If there’s a part that you didn’t consciously realize, Was somebody you were neglecting? You can always shift it. If it’s something that other people think you needed to change, but you’re comfortable with it, and once again I’m putting myself on blast, I’ve done that with certain areas of my life that upset other people.

And you know what? I actually did have to live with the consequences, and I do still to this day, and I’m okay with that. I am okay with who I am. If you do that exercise, and you do it let’s say annually, quarterly, you know, whatever it is that you feel most comfortable with, then you’ll probably notice that your life of intention is going to be a lot better than if you let each of these characteristics just drift as they may.

Anthony: Okay, I’m looking up right now because my wife and I just watched movie Elemental the other night. It’s a great movie, a great Pixar movie, and there’s a quote about temper in there that when I lose my temper, I think it’s just me trying to tell myself something I’m not ready to hear. So if you make this chart for yourself, if you examine and you do the internal self awareness, which is not easy, and we talk about this all the time on the show and I talk about this all the time in my personal life, it is not easy to do the work, to do the digging, to figure out what is going on and why you may be happy or unhappy with certain things.

If it triggers those kinds of negative emotions, that, that anger in you, that temper, think about why that is, accept it, acknowledge it, and then say, what is it about this that makes me angry? What is it about this that is making me unhappy? Because I think the people that tend to be short or, or curt with other people.

The people that are a little snippy, it’s because there’s this internal dissonance between who they want to be and who they think that they are. And so this goes back to your earlier point about Changing your intention. If it’s not the life that you intended, then either change the life or change your intention.

But as long as you’re sitting there stewing in that dissonance, it’s gonna make you unhappy and there’s, and it’s not going to change by itself. It’s not going to happen on its own. You are going to have to take, to make the intentional. Decisions to make the changes. You can’t just go, well, it’ll work itself out.

Nah, it doesn’t really work that way. That’s what Spike does. And that’s how he ends up in these situations because he’s not taking the intentional path to, to create positive changes for himself. And so that’s something that, you know, I would kind of suggest to everybody here, you know, both, both here in the room and on the podcast that if you are sitting with that dissonance and it makes you uncomfortable, lean into it, own it.

Some people run from it. Some people go, I’m uncomfortable. I don’t want to deal with it. You’re never going to fix it until you address it. So lean into it and figure out what’s causing that dissonance. And then work on it. Well said. So, now I’m going to we’re, now is the part, now is the part of the show where we get into the skit, so so I’m going to do my best Steve Blum impression apologies to the phenomenal Steve Blum, which, funny, you were talking about Wolverine earlier, Steve Blum also voiced Wolverine in Wolverine and the X Men.

So let’s see what happens when we get Spike Spiegel on Dr. Issues’s couch or maybe Doc and Spike’s couch. So, like I said, we kind of have fun with this. It gives us the opportunity to have a little fun and engage in some voice acting. Normally these things take place in Doc’s office. This is not. This is not in Doc’s office.

Yes, we

Doc Issues: had to, we had to get a little creative with this.

Anthony: And this shouldn’t come as a surprise

Doc Issues: to anybody. Like we both write these things, but a lot of times when it comes to the skin, because Anthony literally does everything that makes this whole thing work. A lot of times I have a lot of input.

So if you don’t like it well, I don’t know why you would come here anyway, because you knew fully well what you were getting with this. This is what we

Anthony: do. All right. Anyway. And the other thing that I just want to add is when we’re writing these, we try to stay true to the character, you know, who they are as a character, because we’re not going to create some fantasy version of the character where all their issues are resolved, because that’s not who they are, and that’s also not fun to write, that a well adjusted Spike Spiegel doesn’t make for a compelling thing.

Right, and so

Doc Issues: for people that are willing to nitpick, I usually don’t even give this disclaimer, but I’ll do it for this one. Just consider Spike to be in that kind of drifter phase. I don’t even want to say whether or not, if you think he survived what he did, great. If he has to be before that because he’s alive,

Anthony: okay.

Yeah, I’m envisioning this definitely pre finale, this is, I’ll put this somewhere around, I don’t know, episode 15, 16. After everybody else is aboard the Bebop, but before, before stuff has gone on. So let’s let’s get started.

Who the hell? Come on in.

Doc Issues: Are you Mr. Spiegel?

Anthony: I better be, or else you’d be dead by now. Plus we don’t usually get visitors unless Jet has business with them. He gave me the heads up. You’re the doctor, right?

Doc Issues: Yeah, some

Anthony: doctor issues. Well, we’re not exactly fancy here, but help yourself to something to eat while you wait for him.

Wait for who? Spike told me he hired a doctor to check things out, and he wanted to make sure I was around. Where you said, you said spikes Jet. Oh, . You’re right. Jet said he hired a doctor to check things out and he wanted to make sure I was around. We’re kind of in no man’s land here. I think we have some bell peppers and beef, but it’s a little light on the beef.

Doc Issues: About then I don’t usually do house calls, but he made it sound urgent except I need a special waiver to diagnose and treat someone so far out of my jurisdiction. He, he already took

Anthony: care of them. Right. Sure he did. Whatever.

Doc Issues: Good. Then there’s the other part of the misunderstanding I need to clarify.

Anthony: Don’t tell me you forgot your equipment. I figured you’d need hardware tools if you have to deal with Jet’s arm. I’m not North of East. Then maybe he’s got a cold or something? I don’t know.

Doc Issues: I’m not here for Jet.

Anthony: I’m not paying for the bill to get you to the right address then. I don’t know where the hell pay is either.

Spy! Spy!

Doc Issues: Spy! Jet asked me to talk to you. He figured if you were in your own space, you know, you’d be more amenable. Says you have some tough grace.

Anthony: I thought you said you weren’t an orthopedist.

Doc Issues: Har har har. I’m a

Anthony: psychiatrist. I’m a bounty hunter. I hunt bounties. I know what I do. No psychiatrist necessary, unless you manage to pack a better couch with you.

Doc Issues: No such luck, but you seem to be relaxed as it is.

Anthony: Yeah, not quite. Tsk,

Doc Issues: tsk.

Anthony: Ah, that’s more like it. Want one? I don’t condone smoking. More for me then. I suppose this is where you warn me of the dangers of smoking and tell me to quit. You just did it for me. Taking a shortcut, I like that. So, how long will this take?

Well, I’m contracted for the typical hour. Ah, that gives me time for a nap. I don’t have anything else to talk about, so you can stay or go, your choice. Well,

Doc Issues: I, I don’t abandon patience, but I’m not gonna bug you in your own domicile. I gotta kill time. Mind if I watch something on my phone? Suit yourself.

Oh, oh, oh, oh man. Wow, his, his countering is so slow. Ooh, ooh.

Anthony: What what you watching? I’m sorry, I

Doc Issues: always keep some fights downloaded to pass the

Anthony: time. You don’t seem like the fighting type.

Doc Issues: No, but I’m a huge fan, you know, because I view combat sports as like the, you know, truest test of wills.

Anthony: Spoken like someone who’s never been in a real fight. Well,

Doc Issues: alright, be that as it may, if you saw what I saw, you’d have a similar critique, I think.

Anthony: Alright, show me.

Doc Issues: Okay, see? Alright, watch this. This guy, he doesn’t bob or anything. Like, he keeps his head on the center line, so that’s a great trap. Like, he invites every hook imaginable, but, you know, he, it looks like he wants to take a match, but he doesn’t have the hand speed to land a counter punch.

Anthony: Yeah, he’s, he’s way too rigid. He just has to flow. It’s, it’s kind of hard to explain.

Doc Issues: That’s classic, you know, you like water.

Anthony: You know the first person to get that on the first try? You know, it’s nothing personal, but the reason I don’t need a psychiatrist is because I’ve already trained my mind with the best that martial arts has to offer.

That’s how I get through things. I float with them until I need to crash.

Doc Issues: Huh. I really hadn’t thought of it that way, but I think

Anthony: there may be a problem. No way. No,

Doc Issues: no, no, no. Just hear me out. Water as a liquid has the properties you claim, but what about under intense pressure and heat? Evaporate. And what about when it’s cold?

Freezes. So, depending on what’s going on around you, you’re making yourself subject to the whims of people, circumstance, whatever, you know? Judging from this place, you guys must be nomads, you know? But, but you just said, all that martial arts, all that stuff, like, that tells me that you had, like, a real strong home base at some point.

So either your situation was so intense you needed to The cum vapor and disappear, or you became so frigid to them that, you know, you’re more stoic than you should be. You know? Like, I mean, either way, that means you lost control. So which

Anthony: is it? Neither. It’s like I said. I flow until I crash. So when’s the last time you crashed?

The last bounty I knocked out, I guess. No, no, no, no, no. I mean,

Doc Issues: like, emotionally. When’s the last time you crashed? Like, who angered you? Who made you laugh? Who made you

Anthony: cry? You’re starting to sound like ISSP with all these questions.

Doc Issues: Alright, I’ll back off, but the point is to answer those questions for

Anthony: yourself. I’ve had some people tell me the opposite. Why? Because they don’t want me to die. I

Doc Issues: mean, it kind of comes with the territory, right? Your job is dangerous.

Anthony: Ha ha. My life is dangerous. So let’s go with your metaphor. If I do the wrong thing, people get boiled.

If I care too much, others become targets, so I freeze them out. And no, I can’t just pretend that I want it some other way. All I can do is hope that the parts I don’t like leave of their own volition, or I find something else to keep my mind occupied. Is that what you wanted to hear this whole time? Big whoop.

Doc Issues: Damn, that was deep.

Anthony: So you got some time for more fights?

Doc Issues: Depends on if you have more time for more sessions.

Anthony: Well, we’re due for another major dogfight and damage to the ship that’ll put us out of commission for a while, pretty much any day now, so I’ll let you know when that happens. Sounds like a plan.

Now, if you’ll excuse me, I need to go find some protein. If I have to eat one more carbohydrate, I’m gonna puke. Ha ha

Doc Issues: ha. Oh, man.

Anthony: Yeah, I just finished watching the movie last night, so when we were going over everything I was like, ooh, I’m gonna throw in the line about the carbohydrates. Of course, of course.

I did really like that instant ramen noodles, though. That was cool, where you just press the button and pull the thing.

Doc Issues: That is so cool. Yep. Once again, something that I took from that show where I’m like, Oh my god, this is gonna be my life. This is amazing. And then it didn’t

Anthony: happen. Yes, you definitely do not subsist on just, you know, a cup of ramen noodles.

We’re not in college anymore. I don’t even know that we could physically handle that at this point. So that’s going to do it for us here. So I want to thank everybody for coming out. Thank you to everybody who’s listening to this. We hope to be back for PuchiCon Teaneck in the spring. I think it’s March. So Teaneck New Jersey is a little closer to home for us. I don’t know how many folks here are from Jersey, but we certainly look forward to hopefully seeing some, some faces back there. It’s definitely going to be another anime character because it seems to be, you know, what we do with these cons. Yeah, I

Doc Issues: don’t have anybody like immediately lined up.

So yeah,

Anthony: we’ll see. Well, stay tuned to social media, which is a perfect segue for this then. So you can find us all of our episodes on our website, capesonthecouch. com. We are on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, not x TikTok threads. I think that’s about it for right now at capes on the couch. We have a Discord server.

We have a Patreon if you want to subscribe to the show and unlock additional content, extra early access, all kinds of good stuff there. All the links are available on our website. As I said, capes on the So feel free to you know, to follow us and check us out there. And then so the last thing I will say is, shoot, I just had it lined up.

I, and then my, my, my fingers slipped on a button You know, the joys of technology, I was gonna say.

Doc Issues: So, and now for the best team.

Anthony: So, for Anthony Sytko, uh, for Doc Issues, I’m Anthony Sytko saying, see you, Space Cowboy.

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